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Deaf people's experience of music
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Subject: Deaf people's experience of music From: Marion Date: 06 Sep 00 - 04:19 PM Hello all. I recently saw the film "Mr. Holland's Opus" which was about music teacher/composer who had a deaf son. It got me thinking. Is anyone here deaf, or close to someone who is? Can you shed some light on how deaf people could, or do, have an involvement with music? I can picture a few ways that music could be experienced visually or through sensation. A person could watch a drummer and dance to the rhythm. Maybe sign language could be "sung" with a strong rhythm or with repeating variations in tempo similar to a sung melody. You know the "graphic display" panels that some stereos have (what the heck are those for, anyway?); a more sophisticated version of those could be like listening to a melody (i.e., seeing the play of different lights along a spectrum through time). As for the sense of touch, a person can feel a stringed instrument trembling, and the shake of the floor during a good dance; when the music is loud enough, you can even feel the direct impact of the sound waves against your skin. On the other hand, maybe this is silliness; maybe deaf people would rather spend their time on activities that are originally supposed to be visual or sensory rather than second-best versions of auditory activities. I suspect that if I were born deaf, I wouldn't have had much interest in music, but if I lose my hearing later in life, I'll want to find some back door into music. Marion
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: SINSULL Date: 06 Sep 00 - 04:31 PM Actually one of us is partially deaf. I will leave it to her to respond. My neighbors are deaf and have two deaf children who wear Walkmen. (Is that the plural or is it Walkmans?) They also attend dances. I believe they feel the rhythm as much as hear it. Both took classes at the Lexington School for the Deaf where dance is taught as well. Again, I believe it is rhythm and the bass vibrations they are feeling. Disclaimer: These are not professional opinions, only Mary babbling. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Roger in Sheffield Date: 06 Sep 00 - 04:39 PM Whats she called the Marimba player? I think she has very limited hearing and explained that she feels the vibrations which is why I suppose she (Evelyn Glenny - remembered her name) plays percussion in Orchestras. Lower notes being easier to feel than higher ones. Roger |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: The Shambles Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:23 PM |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: The Shambles Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:26 PM Try again |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: The Shambles Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:28 PM Evelyn Glenie |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Catrin Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:31 PM I have some experience of working with people who have a visual impairment. I know that it's extremely rare for people to have no sight at all. It varies both in the how much people can see in terms of information recieved from the environment and also in the type of impairment. Some see blotches, some have tunnel vision, some peripheral vision only..... People may be registered blind and still be able to read (and use the internet) with the help of visual aids. I suspect that the same is true of people with a hearing impairment - i.e. that its quite rare for people to have absolutely no hearing at all. I myself suffer intermittent deafness due to excema (which comes and goes). I know this is no way near the same as someone who has a hearing impairment all the time. But when its at its worst, I miss quieter noises (the most creepy being that I can't hear myself wee in the morning - that's when I know its bad - yes I can see the humour but its pretty foolproof). If people speak clearly I can join in the conversation but may have to ask people to repeat things sometimes. I can also hear music fine when my hearing is at its worst - unless its really quiet. Ironically, my knowledge of visual impairment is far greater than my knowledge of hearing impairment because this intermittent deafness is quite new to me and is something I am getting used to. I know that if I persevere, I will probably learn how to control it - unlike people who would class themselves as 'deaf'. That means the psychological effects are far less for me than it might be if I knew it was always going to be like this. What I am trying to say is that I think this question is not as simple as it may first appear. Food for thought though. Catrin
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Sorcha Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:33 PM Hi, I am the nearly deaf lady. I am not totally deaf, but have severe hearing defiencies. My problem is nerve damage and congenital. There are difinite "holes" in my hearing regarding pitch,tone and volume, a lot of which seems to be in the male/baritone speaking range. Another problem is beginning sound discrimination--ie--the sounds "p", "b", "me", etc. I have almost no hearing at all in my right ear (ie, there is NO ONE in the telephone on that side) and only about 65-70% of normal hearing in my left ear.
I play fiddle, mostly, and diddle around with other instruments. Thank goodness the fiddle is under my left ear! I seem to be able to hear the violin quite well in 1st and 2nd postions, but the higher notes in 3rd and above positions are not there. This, of course, curtailed my Violinist Period. I have the technique but not the ear for intonation in high positions.
I DO feel the beat both through the floor and through the mastoid bone which is very good, because a lot of the bass register is not there either. I often play with my foot on the bass board of the washtub bass, or watch the rhythm players VERY carefully! (It's tough to "see" the true beat when watching a bodhran player--LOL)
All the things you "assumed" above are quite true, and besides, music is a social activity, and deaf/haring impaired people are just as social as anyone else. You don't have to hear the melody to feel the beat, or dance, clap, etc. Like Roberta Flack said, "I feel the Earth move...."
Linda Tilton has done absolutely WONDERFUL things with sign interp. She has degrees in music, sign and dance. She is NOT a talking head--she literally dances the interpretation. She works quite often with John McCutcheon, among others. I once saw her sign/interpret a hammered dulcimer instrumental for John, and it was truly amazing! She transmitted every nuance of the music, and there were a bunch of totally deaf folks in the audience that day--they had come to see and meet Linda. They were so moved that many of them were crying. Another one they do together that is great fun is "Rubber Blubber Whale".
I have played my fiddle for totally deaf children and let them feel the body while I play. They can distinguish pitch and tempo variations, and feel the music. After a short instruction from me to the teacher to them, they was playing tunes correctly on my lap dulcimer. Talk about JOY!!
I began school in the late 50's when teaching ASL was not done in public schools, nor was being deaf acceptable. I was taught to lip read, and pretend that I did not have any problems. I do not sign, and wish I could. It seems to come naturally to me, but as a grown up, I have no time to take classes, or practice. Talk about reading between the lines--Try understanding only one word in ten, and getting the meaning from what little context you can pick up--whooee.
The biggest problem I have is with singing, because what I hear myself singing is just fine, but I am constantly flat, off key or changing keys. I don't sing much, and it helps a lot to have someone singing on my left side so that I can try to stay where they are at. (Consequently, I never learned many lyrics). When the band plays together, we have worked out a set up that puts me in front of the bass, and the other fiddle on my left side. Unless the guitar is right behind me and a little to the left, there is no guitar in the mix as far as I am concerned. This is certainly not silliness as far as I am concerned, and there is a whole world of opportunity for careers out there in this field. Linda has not only opened the door, she propped it wide open! If I were younger, this is where I would go with my life. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Quincy Date: 06 Sep 00 - 05:37 PM I have a wee cousin (8yrs.) and she's deaf but she loves to 'feel' the beat of the music. She still goes to school discos and parties as the vibrations go right through her body and she dances away with the best of them!! best wishes, Yvonne |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Hollowfox Date: 07 Sep 00 - 02:37 PM There's a recent children's book called "Moses goes to a concert" (Farrar,Straus & Giroux pub., 1998), about deaf children attending a symphony. They hold inflated balloons in their laps to enhance the music's vibrations. In the story, the percussionist is also deaf. Nice little book. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: black walnut Date: 07 Sep 00 - 02:44 PM A friend of mine, Bev Biderman, wrote a book about her experience with deafness, and a significant part of it deals with her tremendous love of music. The book is called "Wired for Sound: A Journey into Hearing". It is honestly one of the best books I've ever read, especially as a musician. It has a lot to teach us about how we hear music, and what is so special about musical sounds. Christine Lavin picked Bev's book to be "Christine's Book of the Year: 1998", and talks about it on her website. I would recommend it to ANYbody.... here's where Lavin talks about the book: ~black walnut
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Roger in Sheffield Date: 07 Sep 00 - 03:04 PM I have wanted to learn sign language for some years now. About ten years ago I worked in a factory with several deaf (to varying degrees) people and felt very ignorant that I could not communicate easily. when we had finished work and were on the bus home I was always impressed at the advantages of sign. When one of my workmates would leave the bus and carry on a conversation with another signer on the bus oblivious to barriers of my communication. The noisy busy road, Closed bus windows, bus engine noise and people chatting posed no problem - they would carry on 'talking' while ever the distance was not to great to see each others hands. Beautiful and definitely differently abled. Thanks Shambles I knew I would spell the name wrong! Roger |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Roger in Sheffield Date: 07 Sep 00 - 03:06 PM I have wanted to learn sign language for some years now. About ten years ago I worked in a factory with several deaf (to varying degrees) people and felt very ignorant that I could not communicate easily. when we had finished work and were on the bus home I was always impressed at the advantages of sign. When one of my workmates would leave the bus and carry on a conversation with another signer on the bus oblivious to barriers of my communication. The noisy busy road, Closed bus windows, bus engine noise and people chatting posed no problem - they would carry on 'talking' while ever the distance was not to great to see each others hands. Beautiful and definitely differently abled. Thanks Shambles I knew I would spell the name wrong! Roger |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Mbo Date: 07 Sep 00 - 03:42 PM My sister loves signing too. She's minoring in Sign Language Studies...she would be minoring in Sign Language Interpreting, but ECU doesn't have a teacher to teach the 2 classes required for the aforesaid minor. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Roger in Sheffield Date: 07 Sep 00 - 04:01 PM looks like a good book black walnut. I just remembered someone talking about their cochlear implant a few years back. a woman I think? said it made so much difference to her life. The intriguing thing to me was that at night she could switch it off and have a night of totally silent sleep. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Vixen Date: 07 Sep 00 - 04:29 PM Wow! I'm about 50% deaf, with a congenital nerve deafness that has blocked out various frequencies in each ear. I have a lot of "head noise" (tinnitus) too. I've had this all my life, so I'm used to having a pretty constant "musical experience" even in total silence. There are several neat things about this "handicap:" 1) I can tune my guitar by feel...I can actually feel the beat in my fingertips when the strings are out of tune; 2) singing harmony is a wild experience--I feel all sorts of beat notes, resonances, and other tones in my throat and sinuses when I get "my" harmony note; 3) listening to music is a physical as well as aural sensation. Visualize Beethoven, at the end of his career, lying on the floor beside his piano, which has been taken off its legs, composing by vibration. My dad's hearing is worse than mine, and he plays harmonica and organ. I'm definitely going to look up the books, etc. mentioned here. They sound interesting. V |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Bill D Date: 07 Sep 00 - 07:48 PM We..(The FSGW...'Folklore Society of Greater Washington'), experimented a bit a number of years ago with having signers at concerts & festivals. There was NOT much demand, but there was lots of response....partially because we had one fellow..(name was Barry Micklesberg, I believe) who made it a memorable thing! He swayed and danced as he freely signed and interpreted....making even those of us who COULD hear feel more of the performance. He did one evening signing for a Peggy Seeger & Ewan MacColl concert, and they were so fascinated that they kept looking over to see how he would handle THIS line...or THAT phrase. I do not know how 'technically accurate' he was, but I'll bet any deaf folks who were there got something from the experience. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Lox Date: 07 Sep 00 - 08:09 PM There is no silliness in thinking that Deaf people can appreciate music as much as hearing people. The evidence, (Ludwig Van Beethoven) would suggest that it is possible to be deaf and have musical feel and understanding that is unparalelled by the majority of hearing people. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Giac Date: 07 Sep 00 - 08:16 PM When I was in grade school in the 40s, the mother of one of my classmates was deaf. Many of us struggled through piano lessons with a stern elderly nun. When it was time for our Spring recital, my friend was distraught because her mother would be unable to hear her perform. She cried and could not be consoled until the nun said it was quite enough, placed a chair next to the piano, and seated the mother in the chair. The nun placed the mother's hand on the piano, the child was prodded to the piano to perform, as were the rest of us, and I'll never forget the delight, no, pure joy, in the woman's eyes, especially when her little girl played. Many years later I recalled the "lesson" when invited to come to supper at a friend's and bring my guitar. One of the guests was deaf and the hostess was uncomfortable having music, feeling she was excluding a guest. No problem. I placed woman's hand on my guitar and soon she was tapping her foot with the rest and grinning broadly. Good thread, thanks for the reminder. Giac |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: momnopp Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:19 PM Very cool thread, indeed. I have some friends and a neighbor who are sign language interpreters. I hope to learn someday (in my spare time. . .) FYI, Bill, I'm sorry to say that from what I understand, the Barry Michelsburg fellow was very creative but he signed nonsense.
Libby McKnight of FSGW does alot of interpreting folk music for the Takoma Park Folk Festival
JudyO |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Bill D Date: 07 Sep 00 - 11:26 PM hmmmm...it 'sounded' fine to me....*wry grin* |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Night Owl Date: 08 Sep 00 - 01:51 AM A few years ago, I worked with a deaf/blind patient. (American Sign Language can also be done into a person's hand). I had heard that musical vibrations could be "heard" so gave it a try. I started by putting the stereo speaker in her lap, which had thrilling results. I then brought in my autoharp and strummed it while it was on her lap. We next moved the autoharp to the dining room table (wooden)...she investigated the entire instrument thoroughly with her hands and held her hand on top of mine while I strummed....it DOES work! |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: Ebbie Date: 09 Sep 00 - 02:00 AM One night at our folk festival I was within arm's reach of a friend of mine who is quite deaf who was sitting on the floor. At a certain point during the concert I noticed that he and someone perhaps 6 feet from him were making a signed comment to each other. I reached forward and tapping him on the shoulder, I put my finger to my lips and sternly said, Shhhh I had always wanted to do that! Incidentally he is a good dancer with great rhythm. He's told me that he likes drums in a band so he can 'hear' the music clearly. |
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Subject: RE: Deaf people's experience of music From: GUEST,carolemusic@hotmail.com Date: 26 Sep 00 - 12:27 AM I'm looking for music for 'white cliffs of Dover' I play accordion music for nursing homes. Any ideas or help appreciated in finding this tune. Sincerely, Carole V carolemusic@hotmail.com |
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