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BS: Nautical quiz
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Subject: Nautical quiz From: kendall Date: 12 Sep 02 - 08:25 PM It has been suggested that I make up a sea going quiz. Off the top of my head, here it is. Didn't try to make it too hard.
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: kendall Date: 12 Sep 02 - 08:27 PM Damn, I forgot the line breaks. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Mr Happy Date: 12 Sep 02 - 08:28 PM 4. another name for the poop deck. 10. you've just visited No.4! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Mr Happy Date: 12 Sep 02 - 08:33 PM i'll always rembner the film 'sink the bismark'. [my dad was on the 'hood']luckily he wasn't on it when it sank or all my postings would be by someone else. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:05 PM 1. Joseph Daniels, I think. Dunno the mnemonic... 2. I think it means rubbing grease into the standing parts of the rigging as a preservative. 3. IA kind of usually gaffrigged set aft from the aftermost mast. If jib-headed rather than gaff-headed it is known as a "driver", although it probably spanks just as much? 4. The toilet on board, so called because before the invention of plumbing it was a plank with a hole in or similar rig located up forward (the head end of the vessel). 5. Rumours heard around the watercooler, originally the water cask on board, which was the scuttlebutt (Butt is an old word for barrel). 6. A pointed tool used in parceling, serving, laying and splicing rope. 7. Means up the coast of Maine, which runs Easterly. 8. The Bismarck. 9. 10. Swept over the stern by a following sea. 11. A lad on old ships of war whose business was running powder charges in canvas bags to the gun crews for reloading. 12. Port. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:11 PM A few quirks and slangings from an earlier generation than even Kendall's!! (No, he wasn't the original Adam, in spite of what you may have heard!): Kiss the wooden lady To be forced to stand facing the bole of a wooden mast with arms encircling it and wrists lashed together as a minor punishment. Shipmates were encourage to kick the offender in the buttocks while pasing by. Purser rigged and parish damned Said of a man who entered the navy to escape problems ashore; also of a man who entered the navy in a destitute condition Rosewater sailor An incompetent, foppish or unseamanlike officer Ship a quarterdeck face again After the relaxation of normal shipboard discipline during skylarking or a theatrical performance, officers customarily signified that all rules and regulations were back in force by resuming their customary formal demeanor towards the crew. This was called "shipping a quarterdeck face again." Skin or Snake A tube made out of livestock intestines worn wrapped around the body, esp. the ankles, used to smuggle liquor onto the ship. Suck the monkey To draw liquor out of a cask with a straw. Sailors ashore would partially empty the contents of casks of paint and refill them with alcohol. Once loaded onboard, the contents were allowed time to settle and separate -- pigment sinking to the bottom and alcohol to the top; presumably any remaining turpentine would end up in the middle. Piercing the top of the keg with a straw allowed the men to draw off the alcohol. It is unknown how many men died as a result of drinking turpentine! The phrase comes from the original practice of filling empty coconuts with alcohol, the three dark marks on the coconut resembling theface of a monkey. White mouse A lower deck informer or spy for the master-at-arms Gun decking Under certain circumstances drunkenness was not a naval crime. Shore liberty was granted very infrequently and it was expected that many of the men would return to the ship drunk, with clothes torn, and, bearing the marks of fights and riots. The officers of the deck merely recorded the return of each man in the logbook. A man returning in reasonable condition was logged as "CS," meaning clean and sober. A drunk was logged as "DD," which stood for drunk and dirty. A drunken libertyman had one prerogative that had grown up with the practice of granting shore leave. He was expected to conduct himself as best he could in the presence of the gangway watch; but upon reaching the gun deck, he was allowed to curse the officers, the ship, the navy, or any other institution in the vilest language he was capable of uttering with impunity. This practice was called "gundecking" and constituted one of the few ways which the men of the Old Navy had for releasing pent-up emotions. Found at http://www.navyandmarine.org/ondeck/1800nauticalslang.htm. Regards, A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amergin Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:35 PM 2.Meaning of "Slush the rigging." lubing the cables or greasing the lines 4.The head. What is it, and why so named?it is the john....not sure...cause the head of the boat was the skipper and he was a shit? 5.Scuttlebutt. Definition, how it got named.gossip...no idea how it got the name 6.What is a "Fid" a pointed tool usually of wood used for splicing lines 12.Modern word for Larboard? port |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Barry Finn Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:59 PM Admiral (Old Grog) Sir Edward Vernon
Coat the rigging,in the old days with pork grease. The slush would also be sold in port & the profits were thrown into the kitty or into a slush fund
Old Ironside's bow had an open area (in days of yore called the beakhead) just above the figurehead. This area was used for the sailor's to relieve themselves. The wave would wash this decked area clean & the wind would carry the stink away from the ship
the water barrel or cast or BUTT had a hole or scuttle in the middle of it so it could never be filled. Here the sailors would gather to & shoot the breeze & gossip.
a fore & aft sail set on the aft mast of a square rigger
A piece of wood or metal shape a bit like a spike so one could drive it's point between the strands of rope so it could be spliced
Kendall you're from Maine you're a Downeaster & a maniac, that's not a bad thing Kendall, there are worst
the Bismark
When the poop deck (area aft of the wheel) gets awash with incoming sea water
the small kid who goes into a very tight holding area where the gunpowder is stored, very dangerous job
Port, in a storm you gotta make sure you here LARBOARD instead of Starboard, costly mistake Barry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:44 PM Barry: Sir Edward Vernon was a US Sec Nav? I'll call... And what does being somewhere (such as in port) in a storm have to do with the larboard side of the vessel -- any connection? The rest is brill. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:54 PM Vernon was a British Admiral. the mnemonic relating to Josephus Daniels was the replacement for wine in the Officer's mess -- "a cuppa joe" -- according to http://www.mrfa.org/navyterms.htm But grog had been banished from the ordinary mess deck some time before by an act of Congress. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Skipjack K8 Date: 13 Sep 02 - 05:35 AM I've got 'Fid' as the steel bar that a topm'st is supported with. Baggywrinkle is frayed rope bound to the standing rigging to stop chafe when running down the tradewinds, I believe. The heads were literally the heads of the evacuees, sitting on the holey plank, located modestly below the gunwhale. The spanker is a sadist. Skipjack |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: greg stephens Date: 13 Sep 02 - 06:41 AM Fid is also, you know, that thing that sticks out down there, you know what I mean. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Fossil Date: 13 Sep 02 - 06:54 AM "Head" is a contraction of "cathead", the beam sticking out from the side of the ship in the bow (forward) area which is used for hauling the anchor up clear of the water. When not in use for this purpose, it provided a place for the foc's'men (and the lower deck members of the crew)to relieve themselves. What the Aussies call a "long drop", in fact. Many seamen were lost overboard from the heads in heavy weather. The name was, over the course of time, transferred to mean any toilet on a ship. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Fossil Date: 13 Sep 02 - 07:00 AM Oh, and there isn't any connection that I can see between the modern usage of the word "port" to designate the left-hand side of the ship looking forward, and its use to mean a harbour. Surely the phrase is derived from the saying "Any port in a storm", meaning that any harbour provides better shelter than the open sea. In other words, in a bad situation, choose the least worst option. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Naemanson Date: 13 Sep 02 - 08:10 AM What Barry was trying to say was that it was important to be able to distinguish between the words starboard and larboard. If the wind is up and the words are shouted there is a chance the helmsman would hear one when the other is meant. Larboard was changed to port to avoid those costly mistakes. Where did the term "son of a gun" come from?
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: kendall Date: 13 Sep 02 - 08:32 AM You guys are pretty good. Now that you are hooked, I'll try to stump you! But, first, in the old days, a ship was steered with boards hung over the quarters. The steerboard became starboard, and leeboard became port. It is also called port because that waS the side that laid against the pier. (Notice, I didn't say dock. A dock is a body of water between two piers) I'm off for a day or two, but, gird your loins, I'll be back, and you can "Lay to that me harties" Them that dies will be the lucky ones! Ha Har. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 13 Sep 02 - 08:35 AM Fossil "cathead" or "knighthead"? Certainly the anchor was catted. Regards |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 13 Sep 02 - 08:51 AM kendall "leeboard" became "port"? Or "larboard"..? The "port" association seems late (16 C. or so) to associate with "steerboard". Were steering oars commonly used that late? The other problem, of course, is in seeing the English words in isolation. Don't some of the N. European languages use "babords" or something similar for port? Sailors are/were so conservative, of course, that there are all sorts of lovely survivals in thier language. Regards |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Grab Date: 13 Sep 02 - 09:07 AM Re the spanker, it's the highest sail on the mizzen mast. See here for details of a square-rigger's sails. A fid is a pointed bit of wood used to lever apart the strands of a rope for splicing, basically looking like a dibber (for gardeners). A Swedish fid is a variant of this that has a slot down the middle of it, so that once you've levered the strands apart, you can thread the other bit of rope down this slot. Graham. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amergin Date: 13 Sep 02 - 10:38 AM well....what about questions like....a bowline is a knot generally used for what purpose? or...what is the difference between a long splice and a short splice....or when tying a heaving line to a mooring line.....what type of knot would you generally use? or what would you find in the Bosun's Locker?....or what is the fidley? oh well... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 13 Sep 02 - 10:45 AM Well, Amergin -- you could always write your own Quiz, eh?? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amergin Date: 13 Sep 02 - 10:56 AM True...but that would take all the fun out of my complaining..... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: curmudgeon Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:36 AM Admiral Vernon instituted the practise of watering the rum ration. He wore a coat of gogram cloth, which was corrupted to grogam, he was Old Groggam, and his cocktail became known as grog.. A Colonial officer named Lawrence Washington served with Vernon and later named his Virginia plantation for him. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Raedwulf Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:38 AM Larboard dates back to Middle English 'ladeboard' i.e. the side on which cargo was loaded. The change from lade- to lar-, according to the OED, was in the 16thC, due to association with Starboard. Starboard has been correctly identified as deriving from Steerboard. As far back as Early Germanic (which is where the 'steer' comes from), vessels were steered with a paddle or long oar over the right side. Port is a bit more complicated. Its use for 'left-side' dates back to at least 16-17thC, quite possibly earlier. Port has several meanings. In this context, two are relevant, port as 'haven' & port as 'opening (or gate)'. The former derives from Latin portus, the latter from porta, with exactly those meanings. Anyone who asserts that the usage for 'left-side' came about from only one of those meanings is talking through their hat. For myself, I'm inclined to believe the stronger reference lies with it's meaning as 'opening', given the origin of larboard, above. Similarly, the suggestion that port replaced larboard, because of confusion with starboard, in common usage is almost certainly a fanciful & incorrect assumption, & a nautical myth. It certainly can't be proven. I don't say that a particular admiral in a particular navy might not have ordered sailors to stop using larboard & given that reason, but to suggest that everyone ever after stopped using larboard, or that no-one before hadn't already been using port for other reasons, is plain daft! As to scuttlebutt, for once I'll disagree with the OED, because their derivation of 'scuttled butt' makes no sense. The scuttlebutt is indeed the drinking water barrel, the scuttle is probably the dipper, or other container, used to draw water out of it. It's although worth noting, though, that a scuttle aside from being a container, is also the opening in a ship's deck! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:58 AM It's could well be that the butt was kept over by a scuttle, out of operations' way. Other butts would be stored below, or in the galley, and so on. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: MartinRyan Date: 13 Sep 02 - 01:55 PM Raedwulf I agree on "scuttle". Regards |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Schantieman Date: 13 Sep 02 - 02:38 PM If I remember it rightly, the knightheads were (still are, for that matter) the large baulks of timber up at the sharp end which held the bowsprit in place. Favourite place (possibly because it was somewhat sheltered?) for men to sit and yarn during the dog watches. Catheads are, as intimated above, beams sticking out either side of the bows, from which the top end of the anchor was secured when at sea. Each of them contains three sheaves, making the top half of a six-fold purchase, the cathead tackle. This is complemented by a fish tackle which holds the crown of the anchor. Hence, after weighing, the hook would be 'catted and fished' to immobilise it in the first hour or three of a voyage. 'Spanish Ladies' has a verse which includes the line, "Let go your cat stoppers". This would release the anchor from the cathead and let it hang from its cable, preparatory to letting it go. Nowadays, of course, the anchor is hove tightly up into the hawsepipe by an electric, steam or hydraulic windlass, which rather takes the romance out of it. Still, I don't s'pose it was very romantic at the time! 'Heads' are further forward than the catheads, right in the eyes of the ship - at least, they are in the Victory. Hope this is of some use/interest. Mostly gleaned from Mr Hugill! Steve |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Schantieman Date: 13 Sep 02 - 02:41 PM Oh, yes, they had a cat's head carved on the end, hence the name! Don't ask me why. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 13 Sep 02 - 02:46 PM Part of the legacy of the Norselanders, to fend off wanton spirits, mayhap? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,Melani Date: 13 Sep 02 - 03:11 PM Grab, Barry is right--the spanker is a fore-and-aft sail set on the farthest aft mast of a squarerigger. It is not necessarily the highest sail on the aft mast. Balclutha (a full-rigged ship) has on her mizzen a spanker, a crojack, lower and upper topsail, topgallant and royal. Only the spanker is fore-and-aft; the others are square, and all but the crojack are more or less above the spanker. Pamir(a bark),pictured in your link, simply has multiple spankers at different levels. That's what makes her a bark. Cool link, by the way. Also, cool info on Admiral Vernon re: Mount Vernon. Since Amos started out by answering practically everything, I'll go for some of Amergin's: a bowline is used for practically anything where you want to tie a line to something with a really secure knot, such as tying a halyard to a sail in a small boat. A short splice is when you join two pieces of line together by weaving the strands of each into the twisted strands of the other in the opposite direction from the lay, resulting in sort of a long bump in the line. When you pull on the line, it actually tightens. It's stronger than a long splice, but because it creates a lump, it won't go through a block. So for that you would use a long splice, where you twist the strands together with the lay. If it's well done, you can hardly tell where the rope is joined. You would probably use a sheet bend to tie a heaving line to a mooring line. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: EBarnacle1 Date: 13 Sep 02 - 05:10 PM Re: Scuttlebutt. It was generally an open butt [barrel] located in an easily accessible spot on deck, generally near the mainmast. It was called scuttled open due to the fact that the end was open. A sailor not required to be elsewhere could drop by for a quick drink, sort of like the ship's watercooler. The carving on the end of the catheads is probably a lonely survivor of the era in which all ships were heavily carved and decorated. Downeast refers to sailing downwind to go Nor'East along the Maine coast. More later, I am going out to make salvage recommendations on a vessel that broke free of her mooring in a windstorm on September 11. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Raedwulf Date: 13 Sep 02 - 06:51 PM OK, speaking of Spanish Ladies, a song I've frequently sung, & also parodied, the first half of that line quoted is "Let go your shank painters". So what are 'shank painters', pretty please? *G* |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Gareth Date: 13 Sep 02 - 07:00 PM A sheet bend is normally used to attatch ropes/sheetes etc of different diameters. It evens out the strain a helps prevent the narrower diameter rope chaffing through and weakenin the larger. Yes you would use it to tie a heaving line to the messenger and the messenger to the actual warp. For a graphic description try C S Foresters " A Ship of the Line" Gareth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 13 Sep 02 - 07:10 PM There are roads, swamps, and parks all over Rhode Island, Massachusetts, and other parts of the New Englasnd coast, named "Shank Painter". It is a rope looped around the shank of a bower anchor when it breaks out of the water when heaving anchor. It is then bowsed to the cat tackle so the fluke end of the anchor can be raised up and catted, or secured, in the normal sea-going position. That's my story and I'm sticking to it! :>) A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,Baarry Finn, cookieless at the moment Date: 13 Sep 02 - 09:21 PM The water in the butt/cast/barrel if sitting to long would go bad, hence the scuttle/hole so the butt could't be filled &bad water wasted.
Hi Naemanson, ealy 19th century, sailors of the Royal Navy were perimitted to have their wives on board while at port & in some cases accompany their husbands to sea. Because of tight quaters & having to keep "everything in their place" the ony place for a woman to give birth was behind a canvas sheets strung up between two cannons on the GUN deck. To be flogged over a gun was to marry the gunner's daughter & in no blood was drawn it'd be goose without gravy.
The sailor's use of the word cat can be interesting
etc.etc.etc.
Dog may be of wide use, anyone? Barry
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: mack/misophist Date: 13 Sep 02 - 09:28 PM Being able to add nothing else, I add my most fulsome thanks for this thread. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Amos Date: 13 Sep 02 - 10:34 PM Dog them hatches, you old sea-dog, before the dog watch ends! A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Melani Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:40 PM We dog the ends of eye splices by splitting the strands in half, and then whipping two halves together across the last tuck, so that it's impossible for the tucks to slip out. I guess you could also dog a short splice, but it would look sort of weird. Not to mention catch on things. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST Date: 14 Sep 02 - 12:05 AM Two old dictionaries for cheaters (posted before somewhere): Dana: Dana 1851 Lever: Lever 1863-70 |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,adavis@truman.edu Date: 14 Sep 02 - 12:08 AM In my strictly amateur sailing days, I heard "spanker" as an adverb, meaning what doctors mean by "stat" -- right now, no delay, whoever's nearest and before you do anything else: "uncleat that jibsheet, and spanker" Adam |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: Barry Finn Date: 14 Sep 02 - 02:07 AM Hi Melani, I had a feeling that you would bite (heh, heh). Am I in the doghouse? Barry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Nautical quiz From: GUEST,Bman Date: 14 Sep 02 - 02:31 AM On the subject of the word babord, as referred to above in the discussion of "port" and "starboard," I was told during the 80's by a young Frenchman who was off to report as a newly-commissioned naval officer, that they use "babord" and "tribord." Sorry, don't remember which was which. He said that the watches - babord and tribord - sometimes have shouting contests, where each watch tries to outshout the other, saying "c'est babord qui gueule le plus fort" and "c'est tribord qui gueule le plus fort." (It's port/starbord that yells the loudest.) Hope this helps. I thought it was interesting, anyway. |