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Subject: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Garden From: GUEST, GEST Date: 06 Apr 03 - 01:24 PM At the "Local Ireland" Web site, in the "County Clare" section, is a page about the history of Ennis, Ireland. Included is the following excerpt. :-) {snip} "Johnny Patterson (1840 - 1889) Patterson was a ballad maker, song writer, musician and circus entertainer. The colourful character first started work as an apprentice in his uncle's workshop in Ennis as a nailer. He joined the British Army as a drummer boy and became quite competent not alone on the drums but also as a piccolo player. After five years army service he joined the circus as an entertainer. He entertained large audiences at home and abroad with such well known companies as Risarelli's, Cooper & Bailey's and Powell & Clarke's Great Circus. Patterson composed the well- known songs "The Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door", "Bridget Donahue" and "The Garden Where the Praties Grow"." {/snip} Source: Ennis, County Clare History |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Garden From: Raggytash Date: 06 Apr 03 - 07:25 PM Dan Murphys is a bar in Smeen, County Kerry, a few miles south of Kilarney. Outside the bar there is a large stone, probably a ton in weight, that looks like the bar was built next to it, rather than it having been brought there. Conversely it may have been a mounting stone for climbling aboard horses |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Garden From: Banjo-Flower Date: 07 Apr 03 - 08:23 AM Been there even sat on it and its in Sneem not Smeen(what were you drinking at Whitby) BTW is climbling aboard horses a new sport in Huddersfield? Gerry |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Garden From: MartinRyan Date: 07 Apr 03 - 09:31 AM There's quite a lot about Patterson on the web. Short biography HERE Regards |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Gar From: GUEST,James M. Ciric Date: 09 Dec 04 - 12:41 AM Dan Murphy is a relative of mine. The "Stone" was a large rock that sat outside of the Bakery that he owned in the town Newcastle upon Fergus outside the town of Shannon in the County Clare. Dan Murphy had been a Math Professor at the local university. It was still there till the early '90s until the road was widened and it had to be removed. I am related to Dan Murphy on my mother's side, her maiden name being Murray, her mother's being Fanning and her mother's was Murphy the daughter of Dan Murphy. Dan Murphy also had a son named Dan Murphy who fought in the IRA, who had been forced to emigrate to America after a successful assassination of an English lord. My grandmother went back to Ireland before her death in 1993, a long battle with cancer, she visited the bakery which is no longer in our family, and the present owners were happy to show her around. Sorry I just had to set the record straight on this issue, because it is a bit of family pride. Thank you very much. I hope this helps y'all. James Martin Ciric |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Garden From: Big Tim Date: 09 Dec 04 - 04:42 AM Interesting, but almost certainly totally mistaken! Is what you say based on any documentary or photographic evidence, or just family legend? btw, the town you refer to should be Newmarket-on-Fergus, and the County is Co. Clare. Johnny Patterson was raised in Ennis, some miles north of Newmarket, and left there was good in 1854, so, if the song is actually based on his life, it's set in the early 1850s, and based in Ennis. There was no "local university" at that time for "Dan Murphy" to be a Professor in. Patterson has no known link with Newmarket. Local historians have researched the subject carefully and concluded that the Stone was set at Murphy's shop in Simm's Lane, Ennis: Johnny Patterson spent his childhood just round the corner. The purpose of the Stone was protect the gable end of the building from damage from passing carriages, carts, etc. The original Stone was removed in 1928 when the Simm's Lane area was being re-surfaced. Today the shop is owned by the Guerin family. If you can substantiate your story, then fine: but so far, it's only a story. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST,GM Date: 10 Oct 10 - 08:07 AM I spent many a happy summer holiday in Sneem and sat outside Dan Murphys bar for hours as a kid. That stone was not there then. Shall dig out photos from attic I used to lean on the wondow sills. It probably took a crane to get the the stone there but definately wasnt there before 1972. That was the last time I visited for many years. When I did return in my thirties I was very bemused by the stone and believed it had been put there for the american tourists to sit on whilst waiting to use the public toilets that had been built for them. just alongside the pub. There are many Dan Murphys bars in Ireland, but if you listen to the song it sings of a shop not a pub. So the earlier posting about a bakery in Clare is more likely to be true than the rock in Sneem. God BLESS |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST Date: 17 Mar 11 - 11:08 PM I am another relative of Dan Murphy My grandpa is an o'dwyer whose grandmother was Anne Murphy Dan Murphy daughter. i have never met James ciric but know the name as part of my family and i know his story is true. i have seen the pictures of Dan Murphy. and he passed down his abacus to my family. my great aunt was in possession of it until she passed a few years ago. saying a "historian" said something does not make it fact. i don't know the fine details of the story but i have sources. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: Brakn Date: 18 Mar 11 - 05:39 AM definately County Clare. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST Date: 22 Aug 11 - 11:40 AM Its county Clare - you might be thinking of the IRA Kerry Man Jeremiah Murphy? |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: Jim Dixon Date: 24 Feb 20 - 05:44 PM You can see sheet music for THE STONE OUTSIDE DAN MURPHY'S DOOR published in 1891, at the UCLA Library website. J. P. Dane is credited as the songwriter. Lyrics are almost identical to those sung by Foster & Allen and posted by wilbyhillbilly here. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE STONE OUTSIDE DAN MURPHY'S DOOR From: Jim Dixon Date: 24 Feb 20 - 10:39 PM The Kenneth S. Goldstein Collection of broadside ballads at the University of Mississippi (Ole Miss) contains a broadside with the following lyrics. You can see it here. Unfortunately, no date is given, and no songwriter is credited, but there seems to be a printer's name at the bottom: "Nicholson, Printers, 26 Church Lane, Belfast." As many significant words are different from other versions posted at Mudcat, I have boldfaced them. Note that verse 1 line 7 now has an internal rhyme, like the corresponding line in other verses, which gives this version some credibility, in my opinion. THE STONE OUTSIDE DAN MURPHY'S DOOR 1. There's a neat garden spot in my memory. The place I was born and reared. 'Tis long years ago since I left there, I'll return if my life it is spared. To all my friends and companions Who assemble each night near the store. Around Dan Murphy's shop, we often stopped As the stone stood outside of the door. CHORUS: These days in my heart I will cherish, Contented although I am poor, And the songs that we sung in the days when we were young On the stone outside Dan Murphy's door. 2. Now, boys, when our day's work is over, In the winter or summer the same. The boys and the girls they'd assemble And join in some innocent game. Dan Murphy would bring down his fiddle While the daughter looked after the store. The music would ring to the songs we would sing On the stone outside Dan Murphy's door. CHORUS 3. My thoughts often recalls back my memory, To the scenes of my childhood at home, The friends and companions I left there. It was poverty forced me to roam. But since in this world I have prospered, My heart it rejoices as of yore, My memory does fly to the days that's gone by, And the stone outside Dan Murphy's door. CHORUS |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door & Ga From: GUEST,Gealt Date: 27 Feb 20 - 05:50 PM "The purpose of the Stone was protect the gable end of the building from damage from passing carriages, carts, etc. The original Stone was removed in 1928 when the Simm's Lane area was being re-surfaced. Today the shop is owned by the Guerin family." The French call these stones 'Chasse-roue' or 'Bouteroue'. There was a similar stone outside my grandfather's grocery shop with metal spike on top to discourage corner boys fron sitting on it. Alas it was removed sometime in the last 50 years. Nobody ever wrote a song about this particular stone. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: Jim Carroll Date: 27 Feb 20 - 06:33 PM There was a joke doing the rounds in Liverpool at the time the Scots stole the Stone of Scone "Did you hear they'd found The Stone?" "Where ?" "Outside Dan Murphy's Door" Up to fairly recently the shop in Ennis had a painting illustrations the dong; I think it may heve been removed I remember reading that Johnny Patterson was beaten to death with an iron bar while on stage Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST,Starship Date: 28 Feb 20 - 04:13 PM "In a performance in Tralee, the audience rioted, and he was hit in the head with an iron bar. He was taken to the fever hospital where he died, some days later, of pneumonia." |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: meself Date: 28 Feb 20 - 04:22 PM Probably caught pneumonia in the damn hospital. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST Date: 28 Feb 20 - 08:54 PM 31st May 1889 @fever hospital John Patterson of no fixed abode - bachelor 49 years - Travelling Clown - Pneumonia(9 days certified) |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST,Guest 123 Date: 18 Dec 21 - 11:30 AM Patterson was a "traveling clown" Family legend is that the song was written by a tinker/traveler. Is it possible that when Patterson met a Dan Murphy he said, "I got an idea for a song. Could you give me x or y and I will sing it for you"? Then when he went to another town he repeated the process. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: JohnBaxter Date: 17 Jun 23 - 11:15 AM Patterson was clearly a very memorable act! He may well have sung ""The Stone Outside" but is there any contemporary evidence that he wrote it? I have searched and cannot find any 19th century sources that say so. On the other hand there are dozens of 19th century references to it being composed, written and sung by the comedian John P Dane. Are there any reliable sources showing that Patterson was singing the song before 1888 when Dane started claiming it|? https://folksongandmusichall.com/index.php/stone-outside-dan-murphys-door-the/ |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: GUEST,Peter Laban Date: 17 Jun 23 - 01:11 PM Johnny Patterson, the Rambler from Clare should cut through a lot of the noise on this thread. |
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Subject: RE: Origin: Stone outside Dan Murphy's Door (Patterson From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 17 Jun 23 - 03:45 PM > BTW is climbling aboard horses a new sport in Huddersfield? There's a mounting block still built into the wall of our churchyard; it helped preserve the dignity of parishioners who might otherwise have had difficulty scaling a tall horse, and would have been more stable than a stepladder. It looks like a narrow set of stone steps. Hope this helps, even after a couple of decades' delay. |
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