Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger

Subject: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: GUEST,Steve
Date: 26 Sep 04 - 03:10 PM

did any of you see them live (playing guitar alone onstage)? what was their playing like (only interested in Pete's guitar playing btw). was it simple guitar chords, lots of strumming, basic fingerpicking , alternate tunings, capo use, etc? just wondering if their playing truly reflects most of their recordings (since lots of singer/guitarists have another guitarist playing along in recordings and concerts.)

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: ddw
Date: 26 Sep 04 - 04:56 PM

Hi Steve,

I saw all four of them live, tho' I have to admit I was never too keen on Pete as a musician. He was a performer more than a musician, in my opinion.

Of the other three, Joan was far and away the best guitarist. She was not flashy, just solid, on-the-money pattern picking and flatpicking. The other two might have been as good on their own, but they had backup musicians with them when I saw them. I saw Judy (I assume we're talking Collins here) in Oklahoma City and she had a backup guitarist with her. I don't remember who he was, but he was good. She was better on piano than on guitar. And Odetta's guitar work was fairly simple strumming when I saw her in Tokyo in about 1965. But then, she didn't need to be much of a guitarist with that voice, Bruce Langhorn on guitar and Les Grenage on bass. That was where I got to meet all three of them. Just about dropped my teeth when Bruce shook hands with me. It was the first inkling I had that he was missing the index and middle fingers on his picking hand.

cheers,

david

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 26 Sep 04 - 10:36 PM

Bruce Langhorne also had part of his picking thumb missing, which goes some way to explaining his distinctive sparse accompaniment style.

Odetta often performed with addition of double bass only.
I saw her performing solo, creating a very rich 'bed' for her amazing vocals with her strong strumming, putting extra 'dissonant' notes into her chordal mix.

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Sep 04 - 11:01 PM

My impression is, Joan Baez is a very good guitar player...accurate and meticulous. Seeger is a rather primitive player...kind of rough. Can't say about the other two.

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: ddw
Date: 26 Sep 04 - 11:35 PM

Margaret, are you sure of that? I was awestruck enough when I met him so I may have missed that, but we went out for some food after the show and I never noticed any abnormality in his thumb.

I asked him about his sound on a particular song and he explained that it depended on picking with his thumb, "brushing" with his nubs and picking lead and high harmony with his ring and little fingers.

cheers,

david

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 04:29 AM

of course, Pete Seeger is more of a banjo player than guitarist

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: freda underhill
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 04:42 AM

this interview with peter fonda comments:

The interview quoted below appeared in full on the website Film Threat: Truth in Entertainment at filmthreat.com.
PETER FONDA SHOWS HIS "HIRED HAND"
by Tim Merrill (2003-11-02)

How did you hook up with Langhorne? I know he used to be a session guitarist for Bob Dylan, and played on "Bringing It All Back Home" and "Blonde on Blonde."

Fonda: He was producing an album for me, "Got to Get You Into My Life," through Hugh Masekela's label. At the time I told him about "Easy Rider," and he told me he thought I ought make that film. Then I came back to work with him again, up comes "The Hired Hand" and I knew who was going to score it. If he were to walk in right now and you didn't see Bruce, you would feel his presence. He just emanates love and kindness, in addition to being a virtuoso on like 50 string instruments. I took him over to Hawaii once, he heard the slack-key guitar and went full-on Hawaiian! But he lives in Venice now, and he also makes a great hot sauce - Brother Bru-Bru's Hot Sauce.

Bloom: There are so many things about this movie that are perfect, and Bruce's score is one of them. You can't imagine any other score with this film.

And it was his first film score, right?

Fonda: Yeah. Universal told me, "You can't just hire your friends, man." But the word "virtuoso," applied to musical instruments, means something. Like if I want a full string section, he'll go play fourteen different violins and violas and cellos. So I have one man I have to pay who can do all this work for me! Then they were okay with him. And by the way, on Bruce's picking hand, his thumb, his index and middle fingers are all stumps. They were blown off in a rocket accident in his backyard when he was a kid. But he had already been playing, so he had the surgeon sort of shave them down a little so he could still finger pick. And that National steel guitar that he favors, and we favored very much in the film because it has such a beautiful tone - how did he get there? He used old electric guitar strings, and this muted picking. So there's a reason his playing sounds like no one else...

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Roger in Baltimore
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 08:33 AM

I'll agree that Joan is the best guitarist of this bunch. My early ambition was to play as well as Joan did on her first album. Just good basic guitar work there and she has steadily gotten better.

Roger in Baltimore

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Mark Ross
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 10:50 AM

I don't know about Joan being the best guitar player. Listen to Pete's LIVING IN THE COUNTRY, or THE BELLS OF RHYMNEY. But it's all relative, this isn't a competition, folks, you're not supposed to be playing like you're getting paid by the note! What matters is how effective your accompaniment is in presenting what you want to say. As the Romans would say, "De gustibus non est dispuntandum." Each of the aforementioned performers do what they do on the guitar(or any other instrument)as a matter of artistic choice, hell, Odetta isn't playing guitar anymore, she has a piano player, but it doesn't diminish the power of her show. Pete can't sing anymore, but his guitar playing(usually the 12 string, tuned in drop D, which is actually Bflat)is always right where it needs to be.

Mark Ross

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Amos
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 11:35 AM

Paid by the note?? Oi!!! Such a break I should get!! LOL!! IS there such a gig? I'd be rich!!


A

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 11:46 AM

Hi David (ddw)

Yep, I'm sure about Bruce Langhorne's right thumb also being shorter, though less dramatically injured than his first & second fingers (see Peter Fonda interview above).

Met Bruce in Melbourne in '65 when he & bassist Les Grinage were touring Australia with Odetta - they'd previously toured Australia in '62 with Alvin Ailey - and Les even backed me on a bass borrowed from a left-handed player (they changed the strings over for one song!)

Subject: RE: Odetta, Joan, Judy and Pete Seeger
From: ddw
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 02:51 PM

I guess I missed the thumb part; I was probably trying to "look away politely" when I discovered the fingers missing, tho' I know now it probably wouldn't have been more than a passing thing if I'd been caught looking a bit more closely.

Your meeting must have been during the same tour of that part of the world. It would be logical to go from Australia to Japan or vice-versa, just from the travel distance point of view. I'm sure that we discussed their itinerary at some point, but I don't remember that many details now, some 40 years later.

Anyway, nice guy. And Odetta was a very warm person. Les, as I recall, didn't have much to say in our time together.

Cheers,
david