Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: DaveRo
Date: 22 Apr 24 - 09:58 AM

DaveRo wrote: Michael's web tool allows you to post the ABC in a link so it can be played

So does Paul Rosen's simple player:

X:1
T:Frère Jacques
M:4/4
L:1/4
K:C
c d e c| c d e c| e f g2| e f g2|
g/2a/2 g/2f/2 e c| g/2a/2 g/2f/2 e c| c G c2| c G c2|

Frère Jacques

(You add ?t=xxxxx to the URL where xxxxx is the URL-encoded ABC code. There are online URL-encoders.)

Michael's web tool will generate the URL for you after you paste the ABC into it.

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: DaveRo
Date: 22 Apr 24 - 03:18 AM

Joe asked about 'the easiest way to post'. But I think there are three questions:

1. Should the tune be stored in Mudcat itself - which means text. Or can it be a link to an outside server e.g, that Joe controls? That's the most important question IMO.
2. What's the easiest way to post?
   • Who? Joe or a member without privileges?
   • What might they start from? Sheet music? A youtube video?
3. What's easiest - or even usable - for the reader?
• Must it be usable by folk with little musical background?
• Should it be usable on mobile browsers - e.g. iPads
• Must they be able to hear it played?
• Could a javascript web player - e.g. for solfa - be but on the mudcat server so it could be played without external software?

ABC wins IMO if you want the tune to be within Mudcat - i.e. text. If it can be on a separate server then probably mp3 is easiest.

solfa is an interesting suggestion - especially if the poster can just write it with the tune in their head - tricky for complicated tunes I would have thought. Personally I'd find a score easier.

Anything that doesn't work on an iPad is useless IMO. (I don't use one, but a lot of musicians do and it's the most restrictive device.)

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Jack Campin
Date: 22 Apr 24 - 12:16 AM

Curwen's book on sol-fa is free on the web.

It's also worth knowing jianpu, which is the same thing but using numbers rather than syllables.

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Joe Offer
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 11:49 PM

Somebody, can you give us a short summary of solfa notation? I get the general idea, but I'm wondering about the length of notes and the upper case/lower case stuff.

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 11:14 PM

Use solfa. It is already working in the brain of any musically literate person.


I am musically literate but, while 'do re mi' and ' 'la ti' are obvious, when it comes to 'fa' and 'so', if I am searching for a random note in my head, I often have to start at 'do' again or refer to Julie Andrews. I am much happier with 'c d e ...'

Why is it 'solfa' when 'fa' comes before 'so'?

DC

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Joe_F
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 05:29 PM

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Use solfa. It is already working in the brain of any musically literate person.

d.r.m.d.d.r.m.d.
m.f.s...m.f.s...
slsfm.d.slsfm.d.
d.S.d...d.S.d...

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Jack Campin
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 03:55 PM

MIDI fails on most platforms. It's always a bad choice for a public forum. Use ABC instead.

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: DaveRo
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 01:01 PM

That Microsoft OneDrive link to The Longest Song doesn't play within the OneDrive website in Firefox on Linux either. Perhaps it's Windows-only.

I can download it and play it in my midi player - tiMIDIty. Interestingly it displays the words, syllable by syllable, as it plays: I've not seen it do that before. I see that the midi file was created by Noteworthy Composer.

I opened it in EasyABC which converts it to ABC. With a bit of editing to reduce the length (including removing the word fragments) it looks like this:
X: 1
T:Longest Name Song
% midi created by Noteworthy Composers converted to ABC by EasyABC
%%barsperstaff 6
M: 3/4
L: 1/8
Q:1/4=140
K:C 
V:1
z4 G3/2z/2| E3/2z/2 D3/2z/2 C3/2z/2| c3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 c3/2z/2| 
d3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 B3/2z/2|c3-c/2z/2 d3/2z/2| e3/2z/2 d3/2z/2 c3/2z/2| 
c3/2z/2 B3/2z/2 A3/2z/2| G3/2z/2 A3/2z/2 F3/2z/2|G3-G/2z/2 G3/2z/2| 
E3/2z/2 D3/2z/2 C3/2z/2| c3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 c3/2z/2| d3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 B3/2z/2|
c3-c/2z/2 c3/2z/2| e3/2z/2 d3/2z/2 c3/2z/2| c3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 A3/2z/2| 
G3/2z/2 A3/2z/2 B3/2z/2|c4- c3/2z/2| G3/2z/2 G3/2z/2 E3/2z/2| 
G3-G/2z/2 c3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2|D3-D/2z/2 C3/2z/2| 
D3/2z/2 D3/2z/2 E3/2z/2| F3-F/2z/2 D3/2z/2| A3-A/2z/2 F3/2z/2|
G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| G3/2z/2 G3/2z/2 E3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| 
F3-F/2z/2 F3/2z/2|A4- A3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 G3/2z/2| B3-B/2z/2 B3/2z/2| 
d3/2z/2 c3/2z/2 A3/2z/2|G3-G/2z/2 G3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| 
G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| F3-F/2z/2 F3/2z/2|F4- F3/2z/2| D3/2z/2 D3/2z/2 E3/2z/2| 
F3/2z/2 F3/2z/2 G3/2z/2| A3-A/2z/2 G3/2z/2|G4- G3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| 
G3-G/2z/2 E3/2z/2| F3/2z/2 F3/2z/2 F3/2z/2|A4- A3/2z/2| 
G3/2z/2 G3/2z/2 G3/2z/2| B3-B/2z/2 A3/2z/2| G3-G/2z/2 G3/2z/2|c4- c3/2

Here it is in Michael Eskin's ABC tool: Longest Name Tune

I don't know whether all those rests are necessary.

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: DaveRo
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 09:06 AM

Joe Offer wrote: Any suggestions for an easy way to post melodies?

I suppose the answer must also depend on what you start with - a sound file, a score, a wax cylinder, or whatever.

I see this is the post you referred to. It doesn't play for me on Android - midi files rarely do, even without the complication of OneDrive. It occurred to me you might have played it on a midi keyboard: you can generate ABC from a midi device - I've done it with EasyABC and I expect other programs can do it too.

You can create ABC by scanning sheet music - I've done that too. There was a thread on that few months back on c.net comparing different apps (the good ones are expensive).

Subject: RE: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: DaveRo
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 05:01 AM

Post it as ABC
X:1
T:Frere Jacques
M:4/4
L:1/4
K:C
 c d e c| c d e c| e f g2| e f g2| g/2a/2 g/2f/2 e c| g/2a/2 g/2f/2 e c|\
 c G c2| c G c2|

That can be played in numerous apps which many musicians will already be familiar with, and which also display the score. It can be played in web-based tools such as Paul Rosen's simple abcjs player, and Michael Eskin's complex one:

https://editor.drawthedots.com/
https://michaeleskin.com/abctools/abctools.html

Michael's web tool allows you to post the ABC in a link so it can be played:
Frère Jacques

No links to rot. No external players. All browser-based.

Subject: Tech: New standard needed for posting melodies
From: Joe Offer
Date: 21 Apr 24 - 03:52 AM

I tried posting a MIDI to my Microsoft OneDrive today. I posted a "share" link in a thread on Mudcat, and I couldn't get it to work. Any suggestions for an easy way to post melodies? We've had this problem for 25 years.