Train crash- Selby, Yorkshire, 2001

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Ferret
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 01:20 PM

Now I know that in this case it would appear that this was gust a very, very tragic accident and my hart goes out to all involved in any way.

But in reply to comment's by Beachcomber about the previous accidents. As an ex British Rail worker I have witness the running down of the railways in this country for years with a continual cry for them to cut price's and make a profit by all and sundry. Well you can't do that and still invest millions in improvement and upgrades. There are still bit of the track bed that have bomb damage from the last war waiting to be repaired. The U.K. has one of the least subsidised railways in the world. No railway in the world run's at a profit with out a subsidy. And sadly we get the railway we pay for. If you own a house and do no repairs on it for years and years when it eventually falls down nobody is surprised. The cost of automatic braking at red lights is horrendous, but (in M H O) is absolutely essential. If we had slowly upgraded over the years, as new technology became available we would not be facing such a large bill now. I apologize for going on a bit but how many more must die till the money is found for it to be made safe.

My deepest sympathies to all.

Ferret

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: roopoo
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 05:14 AM

Quick note: the tuner's coming tomorrow, bless'im!

This morning's "Independent", apart from promoting our illustrious Rector to Bishop of Doncaster by using the wrong photo (well they are both called Cyril!) also included a quote from him saying that he had spoken with the teams dealing with the recovery of the bodies, and that by "reading the signs" has surmised that they are expecting that there could well be more than 13.

Andrea

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: roopoo
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 01:55 AM

I had a phone call yesterday evening from our Rector. There is to be a memorial service in our church at 3pm GMT on Sunday afternoon with the Bishops of Selby and Doncaster in attendance, along with probable bereaved relatives and others involved. And, of course, the media circus. Cyril has chosen our church rather than the larger Snaith Priory as it was in fact built to serve Heck as well as us. The full name of our parish is Hensall-cum-Heck. Heck church was built about 105 years ago by the then vicar. It is delightful, but would be packed with 50 people in it. (We might get 200 in ours. Cyril says if they can't all get in it's tough). If any of you remember, please send your thoughts and prayers this way at that hour. I simply got a phone call which began, "Andrea: brace yourself!" I am now in a bit of a panic because the organ has been acting up, with stops misbehaving and I am going to have to try and do something about it today, which may not be possible. The actual service isn't worrying me as orders of service are to be prepared, and all I and my fellow churchwarden have to do is prepare everything, dragoon people into handing the service sheets out and make sure everyone has what they need. And, I suppose, do the ceremonial bit of escorting the clargy up and down the aisle. (If that bit does go out, and any of you catch it, I'm the taller of the two of us!)

I drove up through the other end of Heck yesterday on my way back from Doncaster. Apart from an outside broadcast wagon going out of the village it was very quiet. You could just see the top of a tall crane in the distance as it was starting to assemble the big heavy-lifter. I spoke to one of my Morris friends last night who is a patient-transfer ambulance driver and who was called down to Heck. (And luckily not needed eventually). He said that the first fire crew on the scene was from Snaith, and he saw them as they came off site. He said that they looked really affected by what they had seen and had to do. He also said that when you actually stand and look at the wreckage you are just blown away by the sheer scale of the damage and wonder how anyone got out alive at all from some of it. He stood and looked at the freight loco and said you just don't realise what a lucky escape the people in the houses had and how close it actually came to them. When you are at ground level the sheer size and height of the engine is brought home to you.

Andrea

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 06:44 PM

Penny, I would not like to speculate over this accident but it is quite possible to just go to sleep for a split second before coming to again. I nearly smashed a car going over the Cat and Fiddle that way, my mother found herself on the wrong side of the road coming back from Pembroke once... It doesn't take a lot and believe me, you wake up with a jolt!

Jon

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Penny S.
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 06:32 PM

There is now a move to show that the driver of the car was sleeping. His family has been on the media denying this and saying how shattered he is. The vehicle left the road before the crash barrier at the bridge, a barrier which extends 30 metres each side, and slid down the embankment onto the track. The road was slippy, and he was towing a lowloader with another vehicle on it, so would have been harder to control if there was a problem.

I think with sympathy, as does Ferret, of the workers at the site. I knew a BR worker who worked on the rescue at the Hither Green crash, years ago, where casualties were worse, and he told us more than we wanted to know about the tasks he had to do to bring the living out.

I've just heard a comment that the time involved was 40 seconds between the vehicle reaching the track and the express arriving. Which suggests that the driver was not drowsy.

Penny

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 05:00 PM

It wasn't a car trying to cross the track - a burst tyre or something like that sent the car off the motorway, and down a slope onto the rail. Presumably the crash barriers by the road weren't in the right place or something, but this time I don't think any of the drivers can have any blame attached.

But the strangest thing seems to be that the locomotive pulling the passenger train is now reported to have been one of those involved in the recent Hatfield Crash.

Things like this should remind us that songs about train crashes and other disasters shouldn't be treated as joke-songs, as they so often are, but sung with respect.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: CamiSu
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 04:08 PM

My sympathies to all, (and I must admit I thought about where Jessica was, when I heard). However, the train people really cannot do anything when a car goes on the track. So often cars think they can beat the train, and go around the barriers. At that point there is NOTHING the engineers can do at all. There is simply too much mass to stop in time. I had an engineer tell me once, "It's not if you hit a car, it's when."

Morty, your ilk have my greatest appreciation. My friend is a social worker in Dartmouth's Mary Hitchcock Hospital. She works in the pedi dept and was a wonderful support when my son was hit by a stack of green lumber. I was so glad she was there.

CamiSu

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Hollowfox
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 03:41 PM

Amen to that, Beachcomber. Thanks to those in your profession working so hard right now, Morticia. There'll be another candle on my mantel tonight for both.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: beachcomber
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 02:13 PM

Sincere condolences to any one who is concerned in that horrific train accident. It does appear to have been the result of a most unfortunate co-incidence and this time, at least the railway are not to blame. What has happened to the great safety record that BR had for so many years, that there have been a spate of crashes over the last few? A speedy recovery to all the injured and as we say in Ireland "A bed among the saints " for all the unfortunate dead.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: GUEST,Sam Pirt
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 01:10 PM

My thoughts are with all those who have been cought up in this unfortunate chain of events.

Yours, Sam

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: roopoo
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 02:04 AM

I have just got up on a morning with frost white-over. I feel for the emergency services. It was beginning to freeze by evening yesterday, and -3C was forecast. I don't know how long they worked, but they are to resume the removal of bodies today. During the night, they have had a temporary road built to allow machinery and vehicular access. The bodies are being taken to an RAF base. Only now can the grim task of identification begin. Please keep the families in your thoughts.

It isn't so long ago, maybe only a few weeks or days even, that between Gowdall and Little Heck, the cluster of cottages and farms that straddle the A645 about a quarter of a mile north of the M62, there was a slow speed limit on the track which was in force for a long time. The embankment was seriously weakened by the recent floods, and had to be reinforced. I guess, from seeing them going over the bridge there, that the trains were going 30mph at the most, although it's hard to tell when you are in a moving car. The work is almost complete, but if that had still been in force the passenger train would only have been accelerating, not travelling in excess of 100mph.

Andrea

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Metchosin
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 07:16 PM

Present concern regarding the earthquake aside for the moment, all my best wishes for those involved. I have ridden that train before, so I have quite a few personal memories.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: roopoo
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 07:05 PM

The snow wasn't settling deeply - by 7.30am it had virtually all gone in our village.

It seems to be all a matter of deeply unfortunate timing that influenced a series of tragic events. If the car accident had happened a few minutes later, the passenger train might have missed it. From the film footage I have seen, the landrover didn't seem to be far enough onto the track to cause a hazard to the freight driver.

Andrea

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 07:04 PM

mouldy/Andrea, thank you for that moving account...sending light, loving support, and energy to all involved...so sad...this whole day has been unnerving

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Penny S.
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:58 PM

It seems there just wasn't time for the trains to be switched. The driver of the Landrover had got out and was phoning the emergency services when the express hit.

Penny

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Morticia
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:57 PM

Sorcha, we had snow blizzards on that stretch at the timeof the accident.....presumably the rail should have been higher but it isn't necessarily the drivers fault.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: roopoo
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:56 PM

Our Rector was on the scene about half an hour after it happened, and was still there 12 hours later. (I presume he got something to eat in that time as he's just recovering from pneumonia himself and it's been cold today). He spoke on TV about the lack of panic, the work of the local people and the rescue services. Nobody will be able to exaggerate the role these wonderful people have played, especially as many of them have only had experience of mock-accidents of this type. Yet the emergency plans fired into action and worked!

Tonight at 7.45 we gathered in Snaith Priory for what was going to be our Ash Wednesday service for the whole of our team parish, but of course we all had other things on our minds. The BBC outside broadcast unit was there, and the normally dark exterior of the Priory was brightly lit. The Bishop of Doncaster had come to lend his support and lead the service, and our Rector (looking exhausted) played the organ and led the prayers, during which he spoke most movingly of what had happened. One or two from the Diocesan Action Teams of both York and Doncaster (who had been all day at the crash site) were also there. The little church in Heck is to be opened during the day with clergy in attendance for anyone who needs it. It is only about 200yds from the crash site.

I live in Hensall, which is about a mile and a half north from Heck (the same distance from Gowdall, the flooded village from last November, which is east of us). The railway line passes about half a mile from the eastern edge of our village. As I drove to Snaith tonight I could see a white glow in the sky by Heck from the arc-lights as the grim task of recovering the dead was under way.

Please pray also for those who now have to help the injured and bereaved piece their lives together and come to terms with what has happened.

Andrea

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Sorcha
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:52 PM

What sad, sad news. What happened to the trains switching computers? (Used to be the Switchman, but now I assume it is 'puters) Crazy Bird, was the bus driver drunk or asleep? How can you not see a low clearance bridge coming up? What about "routes".....don't busses stay on routes?

I'm about to decide that the phrase "intelligent human" is an oxymoron.........(except for 'Catters, of course)

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Sarah2
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:46 PM

So much bad and horrible news everywhere today. I pray for all concerned; may they be given comfort in their grief and troubles.

Sarah

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Biskit
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 03:30 PM

You're in my prayers and thoughts. -Biskit-

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Morticia
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 02:29 PM

Can you spare a thought for the hospital social workers too, please. It never gets mentioned in the news but we are the people who sit with the families, tell them the bad news where it occurs, find them accomodation, money for whatever they need and do whatever else is needed for the grief stricken....all my good thoughts to all who are involved in this tradgedy.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Bernard
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:30 PM

Very sad.

There but for the Grace of God...

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: catspaw49
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:25 PM

Unbelievable accident. As a child I heard of many being the son of an engineer. My best thoughts to all involved here.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Les from Hull
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:23 PM

Seeing that yellow helicopter bringing the injured over to Hull has been a sad sight. Hope that the injured are soon fully recovered and peace and love to the bereaved.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: JeZeBeL
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:19 PM

Peace and love to all the people and their families involved in the accident. It really brings things home when it happens at home.

Blessed be to everybody. Have strength.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 12:43 PM

Hi, Ferret, where've ya been? Only one posting in 2000, I see! Nice to see you back here. You also make a very good point about those who have to clean up and care for the victims. It is a very difficult task which takes a certain kind of person. They need all of the support we can give.

kat

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Ferret
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 11:14 AM

My Thought and prayers to ALL those involved. Don't forget the men & women that have to do the rescuing & clearing up as one who has had to clear up fatalities on the rail way, it can be all most as traumatic as being in it.

How many more must die before they get it safe.

May the gods be with them.

Ferret

High Kat

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: wysiwyg
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 10:26 AM

A link to this thread is going out to the prayer chain.

May God be with each person in need.

~S~

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: The Crazy Bird
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 09:40 AM

Late last night, a double-decker bus drove into the Knippels Bridge in down-town Copenhagen (it has a low-clearance) -- 2 dead, nine serious injured, 28 hospitalized. Therefore, we were double shocked to hear of the accident in England

--

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 09:26 AM

Thoughts and prayers going out here, too.

kat

for news click here

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: SINSULL
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:30 AM

I will keep them in my thoughts and prayers.

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: bill\sables
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:12 AM

The crash occured near where Mouldy and I live. It seems a landrover with a trailer crashed through the bridge on the M62 motorway and ended up on the main Newcastle to London express line. The early morning commuter train, then hit the trailer and de-railed but stayed upright but the real tragedy occured when a coal train traveling north then hit the passenger train and caused the devistation. So far there 13 dead and 31 seriously injured.
Bill

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:04 AM

They are certainlyin my thoughts and prayers.

Jon

Subject: RE: Non-music: Train crash
From: Quincy
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:46 AM

Definitely BP....a tragic accident.....my heart goes out to all those involved - either directly or indirectly.
Thinking and praying whilst seeing regular updates on tv...
love and best wishes, Yvonne

Subject: Non-music: Train crash
From: Bagpuss
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:29 AM

Can you please keep in your thoughts and prayers those who died, were injured, or traumatised in the rail crash near Selby, Yorkshire this morning.

Thanks

Bagpuss