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16 Aug 06 - 01:02 AM (#1810852) Subject: Lyr Add: THE WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (Rosselson) From: JesseW We do have this in the DT ( SongID=7972 - how should I link to this, anyway?), but there are some critical wording differences, so I wanted to list them here: This is from Rise Up Singing (1992 edition, p. 187) (Differences from current DT version in italic) In 1649 to St George's Hill A ragged band they called the Diggers Came to show the people' s will They defied the landlords, they defied the laws They were the dispossessed reclaiming what was theirs Chorus: "We come in peace" they said "to dig and sow We come to work the lands in common and to make the waste land grow This earth divided we will make whole So it will The sin of property we do disdain No one has any right to buy and sell the earth for private gain By theft and murder they took the land Now everywhere the walls spring They make the laws to chain us well The clergy dazzle us with heaven or they damn us into hell We will not worship the god they serve The god of greed who feeds the rich while poor folk We work, we eat together, we need no swords We will not bow to the masters or pay rent to the lords Still we are free You Diggers all, stand up for glory, stand up now!" From the men of property, the orders came They sent the hired men and troopers to wipe out the Diggers' claim Tear down their cottages, destroy their corn They were dispersed, but still "You poor take courage, you rich take care The earth was made a common treasury for everyone to share All things in common, all people one We come in peace" - the order came to cut them down The metadata is: Copyright 1975 Leon Rosselson, c/o Fuse Records, 28 Park Chase, Wembley Park, Middlesex, England HA9 8EH. Used by permission. -- The Diggers were one of many radical movements (incl. the first Quakers) that sprang up during the time of Oliver Cromwell. They were one of the first groups anywhere to articulate a clearly socialist view of society. They actively resisted efforts of landowners to fence in and take over ownership of what were originally large tracts of land held in common by villages. On his "For the Good of the Nation" & his "That's Not the Way It's Got To Be" (w/Roy Bailey, FuseRecs). In SO! 24-4. On Dick Gaughan, "A Handful of Earth" & Billy Bragg "Betw the Wars". A site with further details on the song is here: http://www.seedstar.net/undeep/diggers.html and more information on the people, and related songs: http://www.diggers.org/english_diggers.htm Digital Tradition Lyrics: WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (DIGGERS) (Leon Rosselson) In 1649 To St George's Hill A ragged band they called the Diggers Came to show the people' s will They defied the landlords They defied the laws They were the dispossessed Reclaiming what was theirs We come in peace, they said To dig and sow We come to work the land in common And to make the waste land grow This earth divided We will make whole So it can be A common treasury for all. The sin of property We do disdain No one has any right to buy and sell The earth for private gain By theft and murder They took the land Now everywhere the walls Rise up at their command. They make the laws To chain us well The clergy dazzle us with heaven Or they damn us into hell We will not worship The God they serve The God of greed who feeds the rich While poor men starve We work, we eat together We need no swords We will not bow to masters Or pay rent to the lords We are free men Though we are poor You Diggers all stand up for glory Stand up now From the men of property The orders came They sent the hired men and troopers To wipe out the Diggers' claim Tear down their cottages Destroy their corn They were dispersed - Only the vision lingers on You poor take courage You rich take care The earth was made a common treasury For everyone to share All things in common All people one We come in peace The order came to cut them down @protest @farm Recorded by Dick Gaughan filename[ DIGGRS TUNE FILE: DIGGRS CLICK TO PLAY SOF |
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16 Aug 06 - 01:38 AM (#1810872) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down From: mack/misophist When Cornwallis surrendered to Washington at Yorktown, the English band is said to have played a song by this name; obviously not the same one. Can any one direct me to a midi or something of the older song? |
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16 Aug 06 - 01:51 AM (#1810879) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: Malcolm Douglas See previous threads for discussions on that topic; the song or tune has never been conclusively identified, so far as I know, and the debate continues. There are several candidates so far as I remember. So far as the DT entry for Leon Rosselson's song is concerned, I think that the DT text was taken from Dick Gaughan's recording of the song, in which he changed some of Leon's words. An internal link is made thus. Type: <a href="/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=7972">WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (DIGGERS)</a> When the message is submitted, this will produce: WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (DIGGERS) |
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16 Aug 06 - 05:09 AM (#1810966) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: GUEST I understood that the song "When the King enjoys his own again" is also called "The World Turned Upside Down" |
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16 Aug 06 - 05:20 AM (#1810977) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: The Borchester Echo Pete Cooper combines World Turned Upside Down very effectively with the Playford tune Maiden Lane. Sample here. |
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16 Aug 06 - 05:56 AM (#1810988) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' So From: Paul Burke I can't say I like the PC changes, which aren't the way Rosselson originally sang it, and are IMHO anachronsitic. And Rosselson originally sang "men", though he also sang "Vile Violation" so he's probably recanted since. |
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16 Aug 06 - 06:03 AM (#1810992) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: The Borchester Echo LR has certainly recanted over Vile Violation which he says he hasn't sung for over 20 years. As he has also dropped the Biafra verse from Remembrance Day because he thinks nobody will remember the war. No. of course the LR original of WTUD isn't anything like how PC does it. LR is a guitarist, not a fiddlesinger. |
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16 Aug 06 - 11:32 PM (#1811895) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: GUEST,Gerry I note that the version given in this thread uses the "We come in peace" stanza as a chorus. I've never heard anyone in Australia sing it as a chorus, and when I tried to do it that way once at a song circle everybody looked at me all funny. Is it generally done as a chorus song in the US? the UK? elsewhere? |
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16 Aug 06 - 11:52 PM (#1811910) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: JohnB We always do that bit as a sort of repeat/reprise/chorus at the end of the song. JohnB |
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17 Aug 06 - 12:35 AM (#1811931) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' So From: JesseW According to the recordings (except for the WMA one) on the site I linked to, no-body adds a chorus except RUS... It works alright, but I suppose it isn't really necessary. As for the "PCizing" of the lyrics; there seem to be a number of subtle differences between versions; I'll listen to the ones from the site above and do a specific comparison, and post the results RSN... |
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17 Aug 06 - 07:12 PM (#1812591) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: World Turned Upside Down (Diggers' Song) From: lamarca Jesse, Rise Up Singing has a long track record of changing song lyrics to make them more "fun" for group singing. This includes converting verses into choruses, when there wasn't one originally, and changing words so that specific gender references are made gender neutral - the afore-mentioned PC cleanup of lyrics. There has been a lot of back & forth discussion of RUS's place in the folk community (see this Mudcat thread for an example: http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=81112). You should understand that words to songs, as printed in RUS, are NOT necessarily the copyrighted versions as written by the author, even if RUS credits that person. My main gripe with their credits is that they don't specifically say "Adapted from song by Leon Rosselson, Copyright 1975" when they have changed the author's original words to fit a group singing format. It is this failure to acknowledge the changes the editors have made, combined with earnest, well-meaning people's belief that the version in RUS is somehow the "correct" version, that drives many in the singing community bonkers. The DT version of Leon Rosselson's lyrics may or may not be what Rosselson copyrighted - the DT itself is full of song lyrics that are someone's best guess at transcribing a particular recorded version of a song, and has more than its share of mondegreens. However, I don't think it is a worthwhile effort to add the RUS version of every song in the DT where the two lyrics vary - one, RUS has already done a good job of making their version widely available in print, and two, both versions, at least of copyrighted songs where the author is known, still alive and able to be contacted about what they actually wrote, are equally likely to be wrong... |
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22 Jan 17 - 03:09 AM (#3834035) Subject: Lyr Add: THE WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (Rosselson) From: Joe Offer Well, I'm now working for the editors of Rise Up Singing, researching all the songs in the book and offering corrections when needed. I suppose it's dangerous to claim to have a definitive version, but the lyrics below are from Bringing the News from Nowhere: Songs by Leon Rosselson, ©1992 by Leon Rosselson. So, I think this version should have some credibility. Mind you, Rosselson wrote the song in 1975, so these lyrics may have been updated somewhat. THE WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN (Part 2) (Leon Rosselson) In sixteen forty-nine, to St George's Hill, A ragged band they called the Diggers came to show the people's will They defied the landlords, they defied the laws, They were the dispossessed reclaiming what was theirs We come in peace, they said, to dig and sow, We come to work the lands in common and to make the waste ground grow, This earth divided, we will make whole So it will be a common treasury for all. The sin of property we do disdain, No one has any right to buy and sell the earth for private gain, By theft and murder, they took the land, Now everywhere the walls spring up at their command. They make the laws to chain us well, The clergy dazzle us with heaven or they damn us into hell, We will not worship the god they serve, The god of greed who feeds the rich while poor folk starve. We work, we eat together, we need no swords, We will not bow to masters or pay rent to the lords, Still we are free, though we are poor, You Diggers all stand up for glory, stand up now. From the men of property, the orders came They sent the hired men and troopers to wipe out the Diggers' claim, Tear down their cottages, destroy their corn, They were dispersed - but still the vision lingers on. You poor take courage, you rich take care, This earth was made a common treasury for everyone to share, All things in common, all people one, We come in peace - the orders came to cut them down. There were just a few differences between these lyrics and what we have in the Digital Tradition - I put the differences in italics. By the way, I found only two mistakes in the 2004 version of Rise Up Singing - RUS has "rise up at their command" in the 3rd verse (so does the DT), and RUS has "order came" in the very last line (so does the DT). Now, the 1988 edition of RUS has only one mistake - singular "order" in the last line - The 2004 RUS added a mistake in the third verse (maybe to match the Digital Tradition?) So, I guess Jesse's questioning of the Digital Tradition lyrics in the first post, was correct. One thing I don't like in Rise Up Singing, is that they mark the second verse as a chorus, and I don't really think most singers use that verse as a chorus. And again, the earliest edition of RUS doesn't have that verse marked as a chorus. In most ways, the later revisions to RUS were a great improvement - but not in this case. -Joe Offer- |
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12 Jun 19 - 05:58 PM (#3996136) Subject: RE: Lyr Add: The World Turned Upside Down (Rosselson) From: GUEST Has anyone noticed the subtle or not change John McCutcheon made in his recording? He puts the last lines of the song as: "They Were dispersed but still the vision lingers on." So Where's the "We come in peace , the orders came to cut them down?" He moves that to finish the next to the last verse... after "burn down their corn..." |