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Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!

InOBU 16 Oct 02 - 03:24 PM
InOBU 16 Oct 02 - 03:25 PM
InOBU 16 Oct 02 - 08:00 PM
Amos 16 Oct 02 - 08:28 PM
Áine 16 Oct 02 - 09:58 PM
Áine 16 Oct 02 - 10:13 PM
InOBU 16 Oct 02 - 11:05 PM
InOBU 17 Oct 02 - 07:35 AM
Áine 17 Oct 02 - 12:44 PM
InOBU 17 Oct 02 - 12:51 PM
dermod in salisbury 17 Oct 02 - 12:55 PM
InOBU 17 Oct 02 - 12:59 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Oct 02 - 02:22 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of Ardboe Human Rights Acti 17 Oct 02 - 02:39 PM
weerover 17 Oct 02 - 02:57 PM
Áine 17 Oct 02 - 04:09 PM
InOBU 18 Oct 02 - 09:53 AM
Fibula Mattock 18 Oct 02 - 10:11 AM
Fibula Mattock 18 Oct 02 - 10:13 AM
InOBU 18 Oct 02 - 11:06 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 18 Oct 02 - 12:31 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 12:45 PM
dermod in salisbury 18 Oct 02 - 01:32 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 01:43 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of ARDBOE 18 Oct 02 - 01:47 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 01:58 PM
InOBU 18 Oct 02 - 01:59 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 02:04 PM
InOBU 18 Oct 02 - 02:12 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 02:25 PM
Amos 18 Oct 02 - 02:26 PM
InOBU 18 Oct 02 - 02:38 PM
Áine 18 Oct 02 - 02:49 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 18 Oct 02 - 05:31 PM
InOBU 19 Oct 02 - 12:44 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Oct 02 - 10:23 AM
InOBU 19 Oct 02 - 10:39 AM
Áine 19 Oct 02 - 11:31 AM
InOBU 19 Oct 02 - 11:52 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Oct 02 - 03:57 PM
Ireland 19 Oct 02 - 04:30 PM
InOBU 19 Oct 02 - 05:06 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Oct 02 - 05:34 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Oct 02 - 05:46 PM
Ireland 19 Oct 02 - 06:16 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Oct 02 - 08:01 PM
Áine 19 Oct 02 - 08:38 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 20 Oct 02 - 09:05 AM
Ireland 20 Oct 02 - 11:28 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 20 Oct 02 - 04:38 PM
GUEST, Brian F. Hannon 20 Oct 02 - 05:30 PM
Ireland 20 Oct 02 - 05:48 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 20 Oct 02 - 06:22 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 20 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM
InOBU 20 Oct 02 - 08:33 PM
Fibula Mattock 21 Oct 02 - 05:31 AM
InOBU 21 Oct 02 - 12:08 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 21 Oct 02 - 01:48 PM
Áine 21 Oct 02 - 03:00 PM
dermod in salisbury 21 Oct 02 - 03:11 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 21 Oct 02 - 08:25 PM
Áine 21 Oct 02 - 08:33 PM
InOBU 21 Oct 02 - 10:16 PM
Teribus 22 Oct 02 - 03:11 AM
GUEST,Martin Ryan 22 Oct 02 - 04:13 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 22 Oct 02 - 09:53 AM
Ireland 22 Oct 02 - 10:17 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 22 Oct 02 - 12:19 PM
InOBU 23 Oct 02 - 10:10 AM
Wolfgang 23 Oct 02 - 11:37 AM
Áine 23 Oct 02 - 11:43 AM
InOBU 23 Oct 02 - 12:00 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 23 Oct 02 - 06:48 PM
InOBU 23 Oct 02 - 07:19 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 24 Oct 02 - 04:23 PM
Aidan Crossey 24 Oct 02 - 04:54 PM
Áine 24 Oct 02 - 05:11 PM
GUEST,Ard Mhacha. 25 Oct 02 - 06:42 AM
GUEST 25 Oct 02 - 07:30 AM
Aidan Crossey 25 Oct 02 - 06:01 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 26 Oct 02 - 09:25 AM
InOBU 26 Oct 02 - 10:07 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 27 Oct 02 - 01:44 PM
Áine 28 Oct 02 - 07:44 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 29 Oct 02 - 07:15 PM
InOBU 30 Oct 02 - 07:32 AM
Aidan Crossey 01 Nov 02 - 10:31 AM
GUEST,Ard Mhacha 01 Nov 02 - 03:43 PM
Aidan Crossey 02 Nov 02 - 01:16 AM
belfast 02 Nov 02 - 09:14 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of ARDBOE 02 Nov 02 - 10:02 AM
GUEST,Ard Mhacha 02 Nov 02 - 01:56 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 03 Nov 02 - 11:25 AM
Wolfgang 04 Nov 02 - 11:14 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 04 Nov 02 - 07:31 PM
Fibula Mattock 05 Nov 02 - 03:56 AM
Aidan Crossey 05 Nov 02 - 04:02 AM
GUEST,Martin Ryan 06 Nov 02 - 04:02 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 06 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM
GUEST,Martin Ryan 06 Nov 02 - 07:56 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 09 Nov 02 - 05:49 PM
GUEST,Tenches and Brimes 11 Nov 02 - 08:17 AM
ard mhacha 11 Nov 02 - 04:11 PM
Fleadhman 11 Nov 02 - 04:31 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 16 Nov 02 - 12:15 PM
Ireland 17 Nov 02 - 09:08 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 17 Nov 02 - 03:23 PM
Ireland 17 Nov 02 - 05:46 PM
Ireland 17 Nov 02 - 05:47 PM
GUEST,0123456 18 Nov 02 - 02:32 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 19 Nov 02 - 01:38 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 27 Nov 02 - 03:20 PM
dermod in salisbury 27 Nov 02 - 06:20 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 01 Dec 02 - 03:36 PM
GUEST 01 Dec 02 - 04:46 PM
Ireland 01 Dec 02 - 05:24 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 01 Dec 02 - 08:14 PM
Ireland 02 Dec 02 - 06:49 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 03 Dec 02 - 08:51 AM
Ireland 03 Dec 02 - 09:43 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 10 Dec 02 - 02:24 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 24 Dec 02 - 10:34 AM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 02 Jan 03 - 08:16 PM
GUEST,Brian F. Hannon 17 Jan 03 - 08:39 PM
GUEST,Richard Wallace of Chicago 30 Mar 06 - 01:46 PM
GUEST 25 May 09 - 03:18 PM
GUEST,paul mc gibbon 21 Dec 10 - 07:44 AM
GUEST,kath.w. 13 Jun 11 - 08:44 AM
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE GREAT EEL ROBBERY
From: InOBU
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 03:24 PM

Here is a wee song. I recieved a phone call from Tyrone, not fifteen minutes ago, from a fisherman, this problem is still on, so, let's start with the song... soon, I hope we can put our heads together to come up with a plan for fishing rights for the indigionous fishers of the lough... Your pal, Larry


THE GREAT EEL ROBBERY

Come all you gallant Ulstermen
And listen what I say
I was a hardworking fisherman
From the shores of sweet Lough Neagh
My father fished the deep at Doss
And knew its rocky shores,
But I have lost my livelihood
And cannot fish no more.

The cruel decision the judges made
In Belfast town one day,
Caused woe and misery for the fishers
Of Lough Neagh
The decision that those judges made
Our fishing then was doomed,
When they found in favor of the men
From the fisheries at Toome.

Now we contend King Charles gave away
What was not his very own,
A gift that scheming lawyers traced
To the fishery at Toome.
They've stolen away what should belong
To each and every man,
And for our fate cruel England's law
Well, she does not give one damn.

They called our fishing poaching
And they held us up to scorn,
Even though it was a heritage
To which we all were born,
The waters of Lough Neagh we fished
As our fathers did before,
But because of the Toome Eel Fishery
We cannot fish no more.

For they have a great monopoly
That stretches Europe round,
From the Baltic, Scandinavia,
Even to our own Lough Erne,
They now control the markets and
The prices that you pay,
For nature's bounteous harvest
Of our inland sea, Lough Neagh.

But though we've had a setback
The decision we'll reverse,
For Irishmen they must possess
What is given them by birth,
We'll smash that great monopoly
On Lough Neagh's rocky shore,
And Irishmen will gain their right
To fish there evermore.

        Men of No Property, This is Free
        Belfast: Irish Rebel Songs of the Six
        Counties, New York: Paredon Records,
        1971. (P1006)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries
From: InOBU
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 03:25 PM

PS THe tune to the above, is Star of the COunty Down... Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries
From: InOBU
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 08:00 PM

Lough Neagh, the largest lake in Ireland, is called officially The Shaftesbury Estate of LOUGH NEAGH and is so registered in the Company Registry in Belfast . The name of the Absentee English Landlord is Earl Shaftesbury of Dorsetshire in English where he lives in his 100 room House on his 9,000 acres Estate. The Lough Neagh Fishermen, indigenous native Irish fisher people have fished these waters as long as there have been people in Ireland. Today, they have to pay rent - royalties, for Shaftesbury's permission to fish harvest in the Lough by the power of his families Royal Charter from the year 1661. The Fisher People are NOT happy with this Feudal Servitude so are now Aspiring to the return of their forefathers Collective Fishing Rights. Further, under local management of the Lough, fish thrived. Today the Lough is over fished, and sustainable management depends on the recognition of the love of the Lough closely tied to ancient tradition which is contained in the concept of Collective Fishing Rights, by the Indigenous population.
This note is submitted by Larry Otway, from notes provided by the Fishers of Lough Neah, Ireland. For contact information, please feel free to respond to me at InOBU@aol.com.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries
From: Amos
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 08:28 PM

Jesus!! You'd think these ()&(^*&5s would find their way at least into the Twentieth Century, even if the 21st is a bit too steep for 'em!!   Feudalism for fun and profit -- you too can be an Overpriveleged Wank!! Try it!!

A


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries
From: Áine
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 09:58 PM

I found a website called Free Lough Neagh -- They don't have much on it yet; however, there is a Guestbook where you can leave a message of support.

-- Áine


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Subject: Lyr Add: EMIGRANT'S FAREWELL and LILY OF LOUGH...
From: Áine
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 10:13 PM

Here are a song and a poem I found about Lough Neagh:

The Emigrant's Farewell

Fare ye well my native green clad hills
Fare ye well my shamrock plain
Ye verdant banks of sweet Lough Neagh
And ye silvery winding streams
Though far from my home in green Tyrone
My Flora first I strayed
I adore you Killcolpy
Where I spent my boyhood days.

Shall I ever see the grand old plains
Where in boyhood days I roved
Or wander through those grand old woods
With the girl I dearly loved
Shall I ever more by Lough Neagh's shore
E're pass the summer day.
Or hear again the larks sweet strain
Or hear the blackbirds pysomes play.

Shall I ever rove by Belmonts grove
Or Cranan's lofty hills
Or hear again the fairy tale
Of the rath behind the mill
Will the nightingale that charms the vale
By me be heard no more
As I watched at eve the wild drake leave
For the bogs of sweet Dromore.

Shall my oars e're rest on your wild wave crest
Or again see the salmon play
While sailing o'er from Tyrone's green shore
Bound for Antrim Bay
Or an autumn gale e're fill my sail
With a dim declining moon
See me tempest toss on the shores of Doss
Or the raging Bay of Toome.

Shall I ne'er behold Shane's Castle bold
Or gaze on Mazzereene
Shall my cot e're land on the banks of Bann
Coney Island or Roskeen.
Shall I ever stray by the Washingbay
The weary trout to coy
Or set my line on an evening fine
Round the shores of green Mountjoy.

All for you Ardboe my tears do flow
When I think and call to mind
My parents dear and friends sincere
And comrades true and kind
But I hope to graze on your flowery braes
E're seven long years come round
And hands to clasp in friendships grasp
Of those I left behind.

My friends out here in America
Have all that there hearts desire
My pockets filled with dollar bills
I am dressed in the grand attire
I would give it all for one country ball
At home by the old hearth stone
In a cabin near Lough Neagh so dear
In my own dear native home.

Now hence, also long years have passed
And I'll toast that beautiful isle,
That soon and long o'er that land of song
A star of peace may smile
May plenty bloom from the Bann to Toome
And the shamrock verdant grow
Green o'er my grave by Lough Neagh's wave
Near the Old Cross of Ardboe.

-------------------------------------------------------

THE LILY OF LOUGH NEAGH
by Moses Teggart, Poet of the Boglands
Springfield Mass. Oct. 1898

Do I remember Daisy Tennyson?
Well! To be sure, I do!
Her hair was black as the clouds of night,
Her eyes as heaven blue.
Her sweet face was the envy
Of all the Milltown girls,
And when she laughed - then, you could see
Her mouth was full of pearls.
A dear light-hearted Daisy
In kirtle green and gray;
The colleen they were wont to call
The Lily of Lough Neagh.

Her dad in Californy
Had dug so hard for gold,
When he came home he had as much
As Daisy's lap would hold.
Rich enough for a princess,
She might have wed an Earl,
But Daisy loved a fish-lad,
And he adored the girl.
On Lough neagh's banks at sunset
Oft would these lovers stray -
Soft kisses were the dews that fed
The Lily of Lough Neagh.

No useless shoes or stockings
Would lovely Daisy wear,
Her feet were white as buttermilk,
Her shapely ankles bare.
Her namesakes in the dewy grass
And on the rampers brown,
Outdone by Daisy's soft white feet,
Their rosy heads hung down.
But like herself in snowy white -
On Daisy's weddin' day
They bloomed and blushed wherever went
The Lily of Lough Neagh.

Do I remember Daisy Tennyson?
Indeed, indeed I do!
Her hair was black as the clouds of night,
Her eyes as heaven blue.
A daughter of Hibernia,
Sweet lass! I see her still, -
No purtier colleen ever walked
The wilds of Columbkill.
If in them parts you ever meet
A grand old man and gray,
Just ask him if he ever knew
The Lily of Lough Neagh


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 16 Oct 02 - 11:05 PM

Áine, a chara! Great start and help. thanks to all, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 07:35 AM

There is more on this under the post BOSTON REGION MUDCATTERS. I think it is time for a Boston Tea/Eel party! Irish Americans to the door! Cheers Larry

blue clicky thing added by mudelf ;-)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 12:44 PM

A Lórcan a chara chóir,

Any chance you could find a tune that would fit The Lily of Lough Neagh? It's just beggin' to be sung, don't ya think? And do you know the tune to The Emigrant's Farewell? I think I have a recording of it somewhere; but, I can't bend down or reach up at the moment, so I can't look for it.

Le grá is mise Áine

(P.S. Who wrote The Great Eel Robbery?)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 12:51 PM

The Great Eel Robbery was done by a band called the Men of No Property, back when... We'll have to speak on the phone to come up with the wee songs above, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 12:55 PM

Having been born in Toome, and, as a nipper, having gone out on to the lough with both the licensed fishermen and 'poachers', whose boats were less than half a mile way around the shore, I am pretty well bound to chip in to this thread. Perhaps I am mistaken, but I thought this issue had been resolved some years ago. The monopoly of the Toome Eel Fishery originates, I think, in rights given to the City of London by King James to encourage it to invest and set up plantations in this part of Northern Ireland. But was not the fishery bought out by a commune of eel fishermen in the 1960s? For sure, it has been a complex issue. Being from Toome does not mean, of course, that I am qualified to make head or tail of any of it. But I would be interested to know of any authoritative account.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 12:59 PM

Dermond, your right that there was a change after a case about the monopoly a few years back. I have been in touch with a Lough Neagh fisherman, part of an association, who tells me that it has only lead to new troubles, that absentee landlordism is still at the root. Hopefully my friend may post to this soon, in the mean time, I am learning what I can from him. Cheers Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 02:22 PM

The tune of the Blarney Roses would fit the Lily of Lough Neagh pretty well, with a repeat. That's in the DT I think, but it won't open for me at present, so here is a link to the song on another site, thouh without the tune.

And a Rose for a Lily seems an appropriate connection.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of Ardboe Human Rights Acti
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 02:39 PM

Right you are , Larry ,from the Tree of Landlordism ,at the Root how can the Situation be expected to bear the Fruits of Emancipation , Liberation and Freedom , all that good stuff for The Indigenous Native Irish Fisher People of Lough Neagh that includes the women and the childer to as well . That Tree must Fall and the Collective Ancestoral Fishing {for FOOD} Rights of our Forefathers till be Restored to all the Irish People of The Lough Shore . We will need till get intill the Media in America , a Big Story . I am a bit Choked up at this Time , I will write a DESACRATION of the Lough Saga for you all soon HERE .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: weerover
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 02:57 PM

I think the tune to "The Bantry Girl's Lament" would fit "The Lily of Lough Neagh" but don't know if it has quite the right feel


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 17 Oct 02 - 04:09 PM

Here's some more information about Lough Neagh that I found on this site:

Lough Neagh is the largest freshwater lake in Great Britain and Ireland. Being a lowland lake, Lough Neagh is very fertile with lush and diverse species of plant-life, some of which are rare in other parts of Northern Ireland. These plants provide a great variety of natural habitats for insects, birds and fish to feed and nest in. Designated as an area of special scientific interest, Lough Neagh is one of Europe's most important wetland environments. Each winter the lough attracts the largest number of wildfowl in the British Isles (up to 100,000), which makes it one of the most important refuge sites for birds in Europe. Lough Neagh is also a very rich fishing ground and consequently supports the largest eel fishing industry in Western Europe.

The lough is also a major source of drinking water, supplying 460,000 of Northern Ireland's 1,600,000 population. After use, much of this water returns to the lough via sewage treatment works making the lough an important waste outlet. Unfortunately, over the last century the lough has become slowly more polluted. This decade has seen the levels of pollution once again on the rise. There is a very real threat that, if unchecked, this could lead to the death of fish and insect life. In turn, this could have a serious effect on people who make a living from the lough.

. . . during winter, Lough Neagh attracts the largest number of wildfowl in the British Isles (up to 100,000). These birds, mostly ducks, come from Iceland, Russia and Scandinavia. . . . hundreds of islands . . . are dotted throughout Lough Neagh. Most of these islands are part of the Lough Neagh National Nature Reserves which are managed by nature wardens. They protect the thousands of rare birds that breed on the islands.



-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 09:53 AM

Great to see our friend Brian Hannon here on Mudcat. Lough Neagh is one of those places we so love to think about for its beauty and its fame in poetry and song, that we forget that it is home to hard working fisher folks like Brian and his mates, who struggle against nature and injustice to feed their families and a hungery world.

Let's put our heads together and figure how we as singers and artists can put Brian's concerns before as much of the world as we can.

Sing truth to power, folks, I am going to try and get a song out soon, but in the mean time, lets sing Toome Eel Fisheries at sessions for a start, and tell folks that their interest and concern is still needed untill the lough is free and teaming with bounty.

Cheers and solidarity, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 10:11 AM

dermod - yeah, you remember correctly, there's a co-operative.
Info online at:
http://www.loughneagh.com/index.htm

http://ni.iwai.ie/eel%20express/eels.htm

http://www.ni-assembly.gov.uk/culture/reports/report2-00r5.htm#3


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 10:13 AM

Dammit, second blue clicky should be:

http://ni.iwai.ie/eel%20express/eels.htm


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 11:06 AM

Hi Fibula Mattock!

Thanks for the sites! Excellent resourse, though, I think the second one puts a wee bit of a happy face on the whole issue, and we will hear more from Brian Hannon about the realities of fishing to support rents to a landlord who lives hundreds of miles from the Lough. I think one gets a very diffent view of a place when one is looking at it, as one is shooting a net or paying out a long trawl line then when one is writing a piece for the add boys.

Cheers and thanks again, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 12:31 PM

I was just about to advise J V. Mullins about the IWAI Items. You see Folks , You will have to Decide to Opt for either Being Practical and wondering What are we Kerneing about OR Be Conceptually IDEALISTIC as I am.

Personally I in no way can Accept as Righteous in PRINCIPLE to fish in our Lough by the Feudal Rights Earned by The ETHNIC Cleanser WARLORD Sir Arthur Chichester of The Nine Years War Fame [1594-1603] . For his Military Services as Grounds on which his Nephew, His Heir The First LORD Donegall [English Type] applied for and got, all without Due Process, the 1661 Year Royal WAR REWARD CHARTER that DELETED all Irish Rights from us for 341 years till today to the Convoluted paying of ROYALTIES [THE RENT] from the Start of the Alleged Cooperative in Toome in year 1965, who in some complex procedure Pays THE Subsidary [Existing only on Paper for the benefit of THE DONEGAL TITLE] Toome EEL Company Company, who then pays The Earl's Local Company, Who Then Pay The EARL his Money.

This is as Best as I Can Figure, The Fishermen don't pay the Rent Direct. They never paid from year 1661 to year 1965, even though they had No Irish Rights in it. The Above Procedure is started by the Fishermen bringing their Catch till Toome, and then The Priest and his Loyal Office Followers in TOOME start the aforesaid procedure till get the ROYALTIES till the Absentee English Landlord, and whatever is left sent by monthly Check to the fishermen on the Lough Shore.

You will have to Decide for Yourselves the Decision of a Roman Catholic Priest in Blessing The Ethnic Cleanser WARLORD's Reward Charter and its Deeds-in-Tail and telling the Lawfully Dispossessed Tribe that it was All Right.

Also you may wish to Consider The Leadership of his Bishop Doctor William Philbin, The Bishop of Down and Connor, who Blessed his Endeavours at that time. The Ultimate Leading and Guiding Back to in under the Heel of the Absentee English Landlord System of Feudal Tenure.

In year 1965 there were over 200 boats fish harvesting on LOUGH NEAGH and now after 37 years of His Stewartship there is just below 100 boats. Is The Roman Catholic Church Proud of this Priest's Care of This Tribe of Indigenous People?? OR DO THEY WANT to KNOW?? Is there Silence and Denial Here??

line breaks and formatting added for clarity by mudelf


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 12:45 PM

A Bhrían,

Cupla questions -- Who is J.V. Mullins and what is the IWAI? Oh yes, I had a lovely message left in the guestbook on my own website yesterday by a 'c. o'cuinn' -- Do you know this fella?

Ádh mór ort, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 01:32 PM

Thanks to Fibula Mattock for those very interesting links. The account of the fishery dispute by Father Kennedy reads very convincingly. He seems to be saying that the local fishermen cooperative now runs the show completely, and that any controls on catches relate to stock preservation and market forces. Brian Hannon's post, on the other hand, suggests there is still a strong sense of grievance by some fishermen. It may be, Larry, that this is one of those issues that are more likely to be sorted out by a letter to the Office of Fair Trading, if the root of the problem is how fishing licenses are handed out by the monopoly holder. If, on the other hand, the problem is that some absentee title holder is still getting a backhander, then I am afraid Mr Hannon may not have much success. The entire housing market in Scotland is still based on ancient feu holders rights.   I don't envy your task of setting all this to music. But if you manage it, I'll be the first to buy the record.

Best wishes - Dermod


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 01:43 PM

. . . I'll be the first to buy the record -- Mmmmmm, now there's an idea, folks.

Larry and Brian, what do you think? Do you think a 'Free Lough Neagh' CD (a) would be possible, and (b) would help in the cause? I know that I'd be willing to add a song to it -- I took weerover's idea to heart and I've put the tune of Bantry Girl's Lament (with a repeat of the last few measures for the last four lines) to The Lily of Lough Neagh -- and I must say, it sounds a treat. Thank you, weerover!

I think a fund-raising CD is an idea worth mulling over. What do the rest of you think?

All the best, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of ARDBOE
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 01:47 PM

Dear Aine, j. V. Mullins is a Person who wrote to me an Email yesterday evening about the Lough , and when i checked out this site this morning I thought i saw his name mentioned ,cant find it now so I will email him direct .IWAI stands for INLAND WATERWAY ASSOCIATION of IRELAND where someone discovered it, an Obscure place for The Priests Writings . SEE at Bottom right side corner the Words CONTD OVERLEAF for the second part of his Story . O,Cuin is a second cousin of mine , son of a fisherman and he aids me with his knowhow on this here juke box. Best.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 01:58 PM

Here are the links that Fibula Mattock provided above, but with the site names added:

Lough Neagh and Lower Bann Wetlands Website

Inland Waterways Association of Ireland Homepage

IWAI-Northern Ireland Branch-Lough Neagh

IWAI-Northern Ireland Branch- Eel Fishing - The Lough Neagh Eel Fishery by Rev. Oliver P. Kennedy

And thanks for the clarification, Brian -- and say hello to your cousin for me, OK?

All the best, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 01:59 PM

Áine! YES! A CD would be a grand idea. Let's PM McGrath, and try and put someting together in our humble studios, then get some Catter to edit it onto one disk. How does that sound to you Brian?

J. V. Mullen is an old friend of mine, not connected to Mudcat, but he should be! He is the direct descendant of the Mullen who was hanged for his membership in the Molly McQuires, and on his mother's side from another Collins, I think, also hanged on the same day for the same event. Both are mentioned in the song, The Ghosts of the Molly McQuires. He is responsible for one of the Irish Genocide/Famine committees here in the US, and with the Famine walls and fishing prohibitions, I figure he is a good fellow to contact about Lough Neagh!

Great to see everyone thinking and talking about this, it is a good start.

Cheers Larry

line breaks added by mudelf ;-)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:04 PM

Glad you like the idea, a chara!

Kevin is definitely on the 'wanted' list; as well as Amos, don't ya think? And how 'bout Big Mick, too? And if any other 'Catters are reading this who'd like to offer a song for the cause, let us know!!

Le meas is grá, Áine

(P.S. A Lór, did you get my message last night?)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:12 PM

Whoops... I am mixing up Jim Mullin and Pat Campbell. Pat Campbell I believe is related to the Campbell from the song Sons of Molly. I just emailed him about Lough Neagh, as well as my old pal Owen Rodgers from Tyrone... Aine... I did! I have been runing about like crazy on one thing and another... we will get a moment to catch up soon, God Willing! Would you like to do the PM to Kev and the others? I will email the popular halfwit Also Peg, she has a great voice and would be a great contribution to the CD. I will also ask Mary Courtney from Morning Star and Ray Collens - the clear voice of Belfast...
Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:25 PM

A Lór, consider the PMs on their way!

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Amos
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:26 PM

Aine:

I am awful short on disposable time. I am editing the first prototype Mudcat Sampler CD and am faling behind in several othe rprojects as a result. So I can't commit to do a song or CD for this idea just now. But give me some time and let me get these backlogs off my plate, and we'll do something, okay??

A


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:38 PM

Hmmmm, whouldn't it be grand to send Lord Chitch the rent he wants in the form of ... fish? Great big stinking boxes of his share of the catch? I just had this great immage of Jeeves... "M'lord... the mail has arrived... I believe it is the rint, M'Lord..." There on a silver tray, a leaking, reeking box of eels, and a stack of boxes in the hall, crans of eels going gamey... I'd pay to see that! Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 02:49 PM

A Lór,

PMs sent to Kevin, Amos and Big Mick. 'Course Amos has already answered here -- but, he gave me a call a minute ago to tell me that he is definitely in on the Free Lough Neagh! CD; it'll just be a while 'till he has the time to lay a track down. He's almost finished with the the master for Vol. 1 of the Mudcat Sampler CD -- which he says is 'just blowin' my socks off!'

Now, if we could just get half of those great 'Catters to lend their voices and hearts to the fishermen of the Lough, we'd have something that would 'blow the eels off the eejits of Toome', wouldn't we? ;-)

Slán go fóill, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 18 Oct 02 - 05:31 PM

In the Year 1593 Ireland was in full Bloom of Irish Culture. The Irish Gaelic was Spoken in evey Townland and The Law of Our Brehons was in Full Glory.

Then in Year 1594 - 1603 The Nine Years War. In Year 1607 September the 14th, According to English Perception of property Ownership, the Last of The Irish Vacated The Property. The Tyrone, The Tyrconnell and The Maguire. Leaving nothing but the peasentary, who dared not claim to own even the ground that they were standing on.

This War was carried off by The Four Warlords, Essex, Mountjoy, One Cromwell, and one Arthur Chichester of DEVON, A Person of Particular Note, who coveted The Wealth of The Bann and Lough Neagh River System and The Vast Shoals of SALMON who arrived into the Lough Every Late Winter. He, By his Own Hand, Wrote Two Letters to his C.E.O. in London with his Opinion of The Irish Problem.

Herewith these Two Letters    THE "Confessions" of an ETHNIC CLEANSER WARLORD year 1601 in Northern Ireland, Head of Queen Elizabeth The First's NAVY in Lough Neagh from Masserene Fort, 14 May 1601. Recorded in State Papers Irish 355 and 356.

Start of First Letter . . I have launched the great boat and have twice "VISITED" TYRONE with her, and after with lesser boats, We have Killed, Burnt, Spoiled [Crops growing or saved and food stuffs] all along the lough shore, to within four miles of Dungannon [The Chiefs House]. From whence she returned yesterday, in which journey we have killed above a hundred, of all sorts besides such as we have burnt, how many I know not, WE SPAYRED NONE, of what Quality or Sex so ever Man, Woman, Child, Horse, Beast whatever we found that may have been of use to them and it hath bred such terror in those people, who heard not a drum nor saw not a fire of a long time [We may presume that this remark was some Colloqualism of those times], the Last SERVICE {???} was upon a Patrick O'Quinn, whose house, townland we burnt wife, so, childer and people slain and himself [It was reported to me] of a hurt received in flying from his house. End of First Letter.

After a Busy Summer he wrote a SECOND Letter on the 8th of October 1601, also from Masserene [Beside Antrim Town] Recorded in State Papers Irish 111. Start of Second Letter    "I have Found Said and Writen that it is FAMINE that must consume the Irish as our Swords and other Endeavours work NOT that SPEEDY EFFECT, which is expected {BY WHOM ???) HUNGER would be a Better, because a speedier, weapon to employ against them than the SWORD. They are the most Treacherous Infedels in the World. We have too mild spirits and good conscience to be their Masters. No Course {BLA ,BLA,BLA) will bring the country into quiet bu FAMINE, which is well begun and will daily increase. End of Second Letter.

ARTHUR CHICHESTER, LORD DEPUTY in Ireland [Highest Official of Queen Elizabeth The First [was of PURITAN Parentage and as you have read lived by the Sword . . He was Generous in such "SERVICES" to the Irish. It is by THE ROYAL WAR REWARD CHARTER earned by such work, that his Heir in year 1661 recieved it from King Charles The Second by their Line of Lords to this year 2002. The PRESENT ABSENTEE [GET THAT] will receive his   "ROYALTIES" from the Bonded Irish Indigenous Elements. An Unbroken Line of Feudal Fishing Rights unmoderated by any concepts of Equity as generally understood today. Like the 1948 Declaration of Human Rights, 1968 Civil Rights and now the Current Conceptual Expectations of INDIGENOUS Peoples as is being MOOTED in The Marble Halls of the U.N. in GENEVA.

Who will provide Justice for the LOUGH NEAGH Fisher People who have been 341 years in Legal Limbo and are now Skewered back in under the Powers of a Peer of The Realm from year 1965 as like Tenants of Old, all manervued by an Unexpected Patriarchial Organisation in year 1965 and Silence to Date from them.

line breaks and formatting added for clarity by mudelf ;-)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 12:44 AM

Keep the information coming, Brian! It is great food for poetry and song! When times get tough, it is time to get singing! All the best, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 10:23 AM

Jeeves , LARRY , that remark reminds me of a News Item last year . An Amusing little story about our Absentee English Landlord while on HIS GRAND TOUR of Europe . I will need a Fax Number in order to send the Four Sheets to you for till read . You may regale all our friends here with it to what ever degree you like .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 10:39 AM

Fax number on the way! Check you email, Cheers, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 11:31 AM

A Lór,

Any chance you could get that fax from Brian scanned and put into a .txt file to send to me? I'd like to put some information, as well as link to Brian's website, on my own website.

Go raibh maith agat a chara chóir, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 11:52 AM

Áine! Do you have a Fax? This article is great, though it needs a new headline! BLOODSUCKING PARASITE INVADES THE WATERS OF LOUGH NEAGH, and after sucking the Fisherfolks dry, gives the cash to his 27 year old French Porn model girlfriend!!!! That is the title I'd give the piece!

Here is the scoop folks... and folkies...

Shaftesbury (no kidding) the parasite who inherited the Lough, at a randy 63, has fallen for the lovely 27yearold, Nathalie Lions, a Penthouse Model who has modled electric sex toys (sorry folks, this is hard news!) Well, at the shoot she asked the photographer if he had any batteries handy in order to try the toys out! Well, after two divorces (he just traded in his wife of 22 years for this newer model...) well, Anthony Ashley-Cooper (His people MUST have worked at one point, making barrels... when did his people go wrong and place themselves on the Royal dole???) Well any Tony Cooper, (the English Lord, not the very Tallented Derry musician) has spent ONE MILLION POUNDS on his sweetie, which would be a nice gesture if we did not ask ourselves how many cran of fish did Brian and Co. have to haul from Lough Neagh for him to fufill the wishes of his cutie... "She came to me and asked 'Darling, can I have a cheque of 50,000 pounds?" so Tony says with a laugh... he is laughing because he never had hands cut a thousand times by trawl lines as he struggled to feed his family, no, he just finds his cash magically desposited in his bank, not far no doupt from his 100 room kip, and 9,000 achers of prime land near Wimborne, Dorset, and the 102,790 acres of precious waters of Lough Neagh... Now, I think we should wish Tony well in his marriage, and as a wedding present, give him peace of mind, by helping him understand that it is far better to live off the modeling revinues of his new wife, then the hard work of fisherfolk in Ireland. After all, there is much less wear and tear on his wife from her work, where his Lough is over worked, and shows it! Nathalie is still thriving, and he could put some of the money he makes off her, aside to buy a new one when she wears out, you can't buy a new Lough Neagh, now that King Charles is long dead and gone.

Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 03:57 PM

To Fibula Mattock , Thank you for putting up The Priest's Written Statement wherin he WROTE his Admission of the Fact .                QUOTE : The Co-operative subsequently negotiated the Purchase of the Title to the Scale Fishing Rights on Lough Neagh . This is Dated 22 June Year 2000. This was a surprize to some fishermen who held the Belief that the Scale Fishing Rights were theirs by Native Ownership ,A view held By their Lawyer The Great Paddy Duffy{R.I.P.] of Brocagh . Please be so good as to put up the Volume Two of The Same Inquiry where The Priest and his two Cohorts Mc Ilroy and Tennyson arrived on the fifth of September year 2000 to Stormont to Give their Evidence . But only The Priest Spoke . It is at the very back of the Vol Two . It shows us the Depth of his Patriarchy when even his Cohorts did not speak . THIS MATTER OF SCALE FISH WILL BE INQUIRED INTO , BELIEVE ME .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 04:30 PM

Who is responsible for the up keep of the lough, does this fella do anything to earn his money.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 05:06 PM

Yes... he takes care of Nathalie, so that there can be pin - up photos in the engine repair shops, whithout which, fellows who repair out boards would have to ask their mums to needlepoint, "Home Sweet Home" or "Be Good or Be Gone" doylies to frame and put on the walls, causing an excess of work for their mums, who instead can shuttle tea to the workers, thereby speeding the work on the outboards, thereby increasing the productivity of Lough Neagh Fisheries, other than that.... I would have to ask Brian what Tony does for his share!
Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 05:34 PM

Good Question , Lough Neagh being a Property . Follow this Line of Thinking . As an Example if One owns a Property in a normal country one has the liabilities , responsibilitys , up keep, Painting , Cleaning ,etc etc of it As well as the Beneficial PROFITS of it . But NOT LOUGH NEAGH . The Care of Various Bounties of the Lough are the Responsibilities of a selection of Goverment Departments , WATER for Human Consumption, Industry , Amenity , , Fishery Dept for Fish , Ramsar for the Birds and Wild Life , Tourist Board for Fishing , especially For The Remnant SALMON Shoals which may still be caught by The Lucky Tourist up the Lough Basin Rivers .ETC ETC ETC . Even the Uncultivatable Lough Shore which are usually not more than three hundred yards and the width of the adjacent farm is marked out as one of them area of Natural Interest, a Fringe of Land Protected all around the LOUGH and are supposed to be Grazed LIGHTLY by the Farmer Owners leaving for Cover for Birds . All paid for By The TAX and RATES Payers of the Country . If one of you will read all that Stuff marked by the Blue Clickys , a perceptive Person would appreciate that Some Goverment Depts would like The Indigenous Native Irish Fisher People of LOUGH NEAGH TO DISAPPEAR . More Fish for The TOURISTS and the Assines of the Royal Charter . He also gets Royalties from Sleeket GUN Clubs usually Town Business Men who hunt from the Islands and some Shores belonging to People of ""Yeoman Stock "", Ye Ken . and Royalties for Tens of Thousands of Tons of SAND and Gravels pumped up from the Lough Bed by Barges . " THE REASONABLE Stuff " of The Clicky Blues is subtile manervoues of the Yeoman Stock keeping The Ascendancy . If you Know what I Mean .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 05:46 PM

Please Clarify a point for me ,, Are you refering to The Absentee Lord or The Fisher People . Thank You .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 06:16 PM

Did the absentee landlord, get money from the lignite aswell?

I honestly didn't know about this,so much for natural resource's.


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Subject: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 08:01 PM

It was the item from AMOS That I was directing my Question to for Clarity . I was not sure whether he was refering to Us or The LandLord . Lignite is a mineral and as such is claimed by The Goverment who claim all mineral rights in the North . But in the Early Seventys He tried to claim THE WATER of LOUGH Neagh . But he was foiled by even a couple of his Distant Cousins in Stormont who said that we cant have that and took legal advice on it . A Bill was passed through Parliament all the way from the old Stormont Goverment till The House of LORDS and even signed by the Queen . The water is Held by The EHS Dept now .It was very Discretely done .I have often wondered how this Bill and the 1661 Charter meshed . If you are particularly interested in the Lignite Question . I have material on it . Just Ask .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 19 Oct 02 - 08:38 PM

Here's an article from the The Age website, giving a few more 'details' on ol' Tony the Earl. No wonder Brian and his fellow fishermen are in such a lather about this fella:

An English nobleman follows his family motto

By CHARLOTTE EDWARDES AND CHRIS HASTINGS
LONDON
Monday 28 January 2002 (World News)

The 10th Earl of Shaftesbury's friends can hardly believe the transformation. From a shabbily dressed loner who would spend every lunch and supper at the same restaurant accompanied only by several bottles of red wine, the aristocrat, 63, has become a cocktail-drinking bon viveur dressed in leather trousers and open-necked pink silk shirts. His neck is adorned with a gold chain. The reason for Lord Shaftesbury's sudden change in outlook is his new fiancee, Nathalie Lions, 27, a French lingerie model. She is, he insists, of impeccable lineage.

"Her family is from the Haute Savoie - The House of Savoy - which is very close to Geneva," he says.

It is this distinguished breeding, perhaps, which makes the twice-divorced earl (family motto "Love, Serve") so relaxed about the fact that his Miss Lions has so far cost him, in his own words, "a million pounds in two years". Only the other day, he said, "she came to me and said, 'Darling, can I have a cheque for 50,000?'."

What Lord Shaftesbury appears not to know is that suggestions are being raised that his innocent betrothed may have, in the past, posed for pictures which could not, in all conscience, adorn the walls of St Giles House in Dorset, the earl's family seat.

Photographs of a stunning young French model by the name of Nathalie Lions appeared in Penthouse magazine as a "Penthouse Pet" in February 1991. The pictures were said to have been taken when the model was only 16, which would make her current age 27 - the same age as the earl's fiancee.

While he was himself struck by the superficial similarities between the two women, and the fact that they share the same name, the earl insisted this weekend that his companion and the glamour model were not related.

"Hand on my heart, I don't think it's her," he said, after being shown one of the Penthouse pictures. "I do recognise some of her features, but I have known her for some time and I just don't see her in that photograph. I know her as well as anyone - apart from her parents, that is."

Lord Shaftesbury met Miss Lions in Geneva in 1999. It was, said the earl, a difficult time in his life - his French mother was dying after a long illness and he was going through an acrimonious divorce from his second wife, Christina, whom he had married in 1976.

"It was awful," he said, "then I met Nathalie. We liked each other very much. After my divorce came through we caught up. We hope to get married next spring, but we haven't decided where in France yet."

"Having been divorced twice, it's jolly nice to know you can still find someone who really loves you."

Such is the depth of the earl's affections that he does not hesitate in acceding to Miss Lions' requests for additional funds. He had recently asked why she needed more money.

"I said to her: 'But my love, why do you need another cheque?' And guess what she said? She said she wanted a new car - an Audi Quattro." (emphasis added)

The earl, who is planning to move to France, added: "My sister and her husband are delighted. All my friends are delighted."


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 09:05 AM

Up till year 1930 all the Fishermen had was their FISHER COTE about 15 feet in length and powered by Oar and Sail . In year 1931 , which must have been a Good Fishing Year , some the Fishermen got their Boats fitted with Inboard Englines for the First Time with a few feet added on to such lucky fishermen . Duffs of Drumany Ardboe specialised in this Great step forward and fitted many as the years passed . Usually A FORD Engine second hand of a certain type . Up to Present Year 2002 English Law Proscribes the Boats not to be any longer than 26 feet . No Government Grant is a Fisherman Dares build his new boat any longer than this. There are Few Boats above the Limit . Sort of an Extension of Penal Law The £5 Horse .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 11:28 AM

I know this is off topic but can I ask Larry if he has campaigned for the right of the Ogalala Nation or "native Americans", with regards to the Mount Rushmore monument on what is their sacred place. Just interested,no offence meant.

Brian when you use the word tribe, does that mean that only people in that tribe would be in your opinion those who should be allowed to fish on the lough? Or does the problem affect the wider population of Ireland in general?

I wonder what would happen to the landlord if every one was in the position to stop fishing,and stop the funds going to this parasite.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 04:38 PM

I used the Word Tribe merely to Identify the Fisher People as a group to give us an Ethnic touch. It does not signitfy too much . The livelihood of Fishing in Lough Neagh is a tradition that is pretty imbedded in those Families who fish in LOUGH NEAGH . There are not many Newcomers who wish to do so . As a matter of fact mainly by Education many have advanced to Better Work . Leaving The Lough to those to whom it is more inbred in their Bones. Also The Lough is Steadily Declining due Pollution . Which is Kept at Bay by a continuous Supply of new water from the Ten or so Rivers inflowing 1/ The Maine , 2/ The Six Mile Water 3/ The Blackburn 4/ Crumlin 5/ Glenavy ,6/ The Tunny Cut ,now a naturalised Canal which drains Portmore Lough and a lot of low lying Ground there 7/ the Closet River [what a name ] 8/ The Upper Bann flowing from The Mountains of Mourne 9/ The Blackwater which even recieves water from The South 10/ The Lower Back River [Small] 11/ The Ballinderry 12/ The Moyola . AND The LOWER BANN RIVER which carries all out to The Atlantic Ocean . Also There is plenty of Wave Action and Wind keeps Everything on the Move . and the Third Factor The HEAT of an Very HOT Summer which we normaly Dont Get . We would get the Green Algae is the Right Combination occured Sic : LITTLE Rain , No Wind and Hot Weather for many WEEKS . We get such a Combination about every 15 years or so. The State of the Water is TOLERABLE Normally . Fishing in the Lough is normally done by those who live within three miles of it or nearer if possible . When The Tourist Bumf refers to Fishing in Lough Neagh they are Refering to ANGLING in the Rivers that I have Listed . Angling is too Dangerous out on the Lough .It being 15 miles long and 10 miles across . It could be tried by a few small boats with one Large Normal Boat Riding herd for Safety . See next Letter .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST, Brian F. Hannon
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 05:30 PM

For "Ireland" a short history of Events simple as Possible to make a point , First The Nine Years War 1594-1603 . Ireland Reduced . Irish Law and Documents and Native Possession as Zero . Right . All Irish [ REMAINING ] now Tenants of The English in legal Context . 300 years of what ever youse would like to call it , Slavery , Subjugation , Servitude . Year 1900 ABOUTS . By Political Action and The irish LAND [note LAND ] Acts . It is generally Accepted/Believed that MOST of IRELAND was ALLOWED to be bought back by the Irish Farmers Tenants from the Absentee English LandLord Classes . But a dirty deed was done by THE GOVERMENT who paid only two thirds of the LAND Purchase Price so Burdening The Just Emancipated Raggedy Assed Dirt Farmers with one third of the Purchase Price . This was Spread over many years till the 1950's and even the 1960's in some cases till they were clear .A real Sneeky trick that kept our people down while in Debt . Now for the LEAST of Ireland, that Portion that was allowed to be kept by some Gentry . It was generally accepted that the "POOR Reduced" Big HOUSE People would be allowed to keep their Big House and Two Hundred Acres of Land usually the Gardens , Parkland ,Woods and a bit of adjacent River for a spot of Fishing . I make the point that The Irish LAND Commission MISSED the 102,790 acres LOUGH NEAGH as it was NOT LAND . So leaving our poor miserable Tribe [WHATEVER }LOUGHLESS and Mostly Landless as a few of us did get a few Boggy Acres on the Lough Shore . The Duke of Westminster still has 5,000 acres in Fermanagh that is in the North and The Duke of Devonshire has A Castle ETC and 8,000 acres in Lismore in the South along with five miles of SALMON RIVER as well. Even Mount Juliet of THE GOLF and the Fishing is An Estate of a mere 1500 acres and there are Such Estates as that all over Ireland Especially in The Pale . It makes One wonder just how much was Returned . Not LOUGH NEAGH For Sure .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 05:48 PM

Brian, I think what you are doing is right and just, it is pathetic that these people can sit on their butts making money from a source they should not have in the first place.

I am interested in what you post,for me any way it is educational, thanks for taking the time to reply.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 06:22 PM

One must Remember that fishing was/is for FOOD and that Angling for Sport and Tourism is a Sport probably only a couple of hundred years in Practice . For anyone interested Look up "SALMON Survival " on Google to see how long people have been on the River Bann. Also should be accepted is that every Water in Ireland was a FOOD Source . The Prime ones being built near by The Gentry who could spot the Local Natives Stealing HIS FISH ??? and with his dogs and his shotgun have some jolly sport seeing them off his property .{ PEASENT Shooting you know old boy ] In My Comments on here I have only Stated that the Fisher People paid THE RENT which eventually got till himself . I did not imply Amount but I believe it is several Thousands of Pounds . Never the less whether it is a Million or a Penny it is the Principle that Matters ,the implied Ownership Recognition by/of the Legally Enforced Servitude of the Subjugated .Gift of Royal Favour. Now if all RENT ceased from the Fishermen It would Affect The Landlord Little . He has 9,000 Acres of Land and possibly has shares in a big company with the Initials      P. W. C.   C as in Cooper . He is believed to be one of the Secret Rich ,he never joined the House of LORDS till the Last Day ,making only one Speech and it was not about Indigenous Native Irish People you can surmise .Not having any Parliamentary Duties He was not Obliged to provide information to The LORDS Interests Register .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM

Thank You Ireland , I was Composing The third Letter as you had sent your Reply . While I am HERE May I URGE All to Fully READ ALL this Stuff Especially all The BLUE Clickys .PACE YOURSELVES I have The Impression that People flick over all too Quickly . It is 23:27 P.M. Here in Ireland . So Good Night to you All . It has been a GOOD WEEK .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 20 Oct 02 - 08:33 PM

Hi Ireland:
As you are new to Mudcat, I will give you a short bio... Yes, I would have campained for the Lacota re" Mt. Rushmore, as I am, in point of fact, a judge in an Algonquin court, the Court of the Golden Hill Paugeesukq Nation. I have worked with Innu in Canada in trying to stop Hydro Quebec from stealing native land, and I have defended in Native mother's rights cases in stoping out adoption of Native children. Nope, I am not Native, my tribe, as it was refered to in the film, The Last September, is Anglo Irish - an odd wee rather unique collection of rare fellows. Drop me an email at InOBU@aol. com and I will send you a copy of my band's CD, "Nil sasta ach Amadain" the band is Sorcha Dorcha. The CD is half and half traditional tunes and my own ballads which are informed by my work as a political scientist for a number of communities. There is Yvettes Song, about Innu history and rights, The New Saint, about Roma rights, Amadou Diallo about an African in New York, shot 33 times by the police - by accident, (this is getting to sound like a comercial for the CD!) Well, drop me an Email with an adress and I will pop one in the mail.
It is a little thanks as your interest has helped me help Brian to put forward more of the story, and improve my understanding of the problems facing the fishers of Lough Neagh...
Cheers, Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 05:31 AM

er, folks, I posted the links for the sake of clarity because dermod asked about he co-operative. Just for the record, I'd like my involvement to end there. Arthur Chichester was a murdering warlord, no doubt about it, but I would not equate a 63 year old aristocrat in Dorset with Chichester, and some posts would seem to suggest a comparison.
I hope you reach a peaceful solution.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 12:08 PM

One of my fellow Quakes has a studio, and plays a number of instruments, I have been speaking to him about a few new song projects, this being one.
Cheers Larry
PS Fibula, granted Tony is not riding about on a charger, sword in hand, to bully folks into giving him rent, he does not have to, Arther did it for him! Now, he just sits back and reeps the benifit!


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 01:48 PM

Quakes ????   I never heard tell of anyone called that afore . However , I will now Kerne about an Act " THE GOVERMENT " done in the Seventies . Favouring the Existence of TOURISTS and the Angling Lobby and STEADFASTLY Ignoring The LOUGH NEAGH FISHERMEN . They Introduced a fish called ROACH in the Lough Neagh System . These Fish are uneatable and are tossed out on the Land for the Granny Gulls till ate . As said to me the other Day by a LOUGH NEAGH Fisherman in person . They have Reached PESTENSIAL Numbers like the Bull Frogs in Australia . ROACH are Caught by the Netfull with No other fish amongst them . Or one catches Other Fish and no Roach . Their Numbers are still Growing . What the end of it will be no one knows . They inter breed with Rudd and Bream producing Hybrids .It was a bad Doing of them .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 03:00 PM

A Bhrían,

Larry (InOBU) is a Quaker. He left the 'r' off the word. ;-)

I have a question about the 'roaches' -- If these fish are uneatable, then why in the world were they ever introduced into the Lough?

I know that may seem like a silly question to a man like yourself; but, when my daddy taught me to fish, we never took home anything that Mama couldn't cook, or was too small -- we always threw 'em back in the water.

Le meas, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 03:11 PM

Fibula - I have to agree there is a touch of the hound scenting the hare in some of the posts since your original, most useful contribution. But I am assuming music is not yet a blood sport. I have greatly enjoyed reading Mr Hannon's posts. But the discussion would benefit from some input from the Toome fishermen. As another noted Irishman, George Bernard Shaw, put it - the best way to get to the merits of any case is to hear it argued with extreme bias on either side. Larry, as a former judge, would probably go along with that.

Dermod


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 08:25 PM

I am feeling a bit Peeved at the moment I have just spent this last hour writing a letter to Aine . Waxed Eloquent I did . but on hitting the Submit Message Panel It did not work , several times . So I am away till my Bed . see you tomorrow Aine . Best Regards .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 08:33 PM

A Bhrían,

Here's my email address, in case you're feeling eloquent again on the morrow ;-) -- doireanne@yahoo.com (my grandmother's family came from County Derry).

Oíche mhaith a chara, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 21 Oct 02 - 10:16 PM

Hi Dermond. By your use of the word but, in asking to hear from fisherfolk, I assume you may have missed that Brian is in fact, a Lough Neah Fisherman. As to hearing from the other point of view, I agree it would be nice to hear from our friend Tony, (we Quakers don't use titles, so no disrespect) But, I figure Tony Cooper has his hands full at the moment... but, who knows maybe he is a folk music fan!
Cheers Larry
Brian! it has been a good week here as well, though buisy and a bit frightening, my Genie is down in Verginia - near to all the shootings, walking about, as she has no car, right near highway 95, the expected staulking grounds of the sniper. BUT, she is now on a bus back home... I know how painful it is to write a big letter and have the computer eat it! Happens to my best work as well! Speak to you all tommorow. Nite.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Teribus
Date: 22 Oct 02 - 03:11 AM

Have enjoyed reading through this thread, and the thread on "Follow me up to Carlow", both extremely informative.

InOBU's calls for demonstrative action on the part of the of Irish-American community were very amusing. Member Ireland's question regarding "native Americans", was interesting, particularly when viewed in conjunction with something stated by Brian earlier:

"Are we not Indigenous People Entitled to Indigenous Rights .Ask Doctor Julian Burger of The Indigenous Section of The U. N. In Geneva ."

I haven't had a chance to look into the site for the UN Indigenous Section to find out what Dr Julian Burger has to say but if this should go all the way to the International Court of Justice in the Hague, and if the courts ruling goes in favour of the indigenous tribe of eel fishermen - a pretty interesting precedent will have been set.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 22 Oct 02 - 04:13 AM

Two questions, please:
1. Any eel songs - other than Lord Randal?
2. What is an eel stew called in those Northern parts, assuming it's anything other than "eel stew"?

Regards


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 22 Oct 02 - 09:53 AM

To All , May I inquire if any of you have managed to get our Saga intill any Paper yet . or have any personal contact Information with personages like Katherine Boo to whom I could write . On Google rap in the name Rev. Oliver P. Kennedy and you will see where the this Seventy Years Old Roman Catholic Priest has been RE appointed by a Stormont Protestant Minister for a FOURTH six Year Term to aid this Subsidary British Government in keeping the 341 years Dispossessed in their Place . I would like Direct Comments and Opinions from many of you on his Participation in leading this Miserable Tribe of INDIGENOUS IRISH NATIVES the Unheard of Path of being Lead back to in Under The Absentee English Landlord System of Tenure wherin he ,as far as I percieve, now occupies the unspeakable Rank of the LANDLORDS AGENT . Or are you Priest Ridden Too, afraid to speak against      M. C. The Bishops of Ireland Have NO Trocaire on the Indigenous of their Own Country . Have you no Misgivings at all, at all . Two of his Cohorts have also been Appointed while We The Faction of Believers in our Forefathers Ancient Irish Rights are rejected and so without Representation on the Fishery Conservancy Board . Four men of our way of thinking were interviewed and Rejected . So much for Democrasy in the North .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 22 Oct 02 - 10:17 AM

If the priest was to support your cause what actions could he take, are you saying because he is a priest he should automatically hold your views and not have an opinion of his own?

I agree with you on priciple but cannot help but feel that Dermod has a point "there is a touch of the hound scenting the hare" and that does not keep with democracy either.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 22 Oct 02 - 12:19 PM

Around the year 1910 There was a court case that went as Far As the House of LORDs . For the many of you who dont know , that place Was and is the Highest Court in The Land . These LORDS , Barons Earls and others of the Landed Gentry Decided that the LORD's Donegal/ Shaftesbury Title to Lough Neagh and the Bann was righteous and that there was no Irish Public Right of Anything in the Lough regardless of Massive and Open Native Possession of all things from Antiquity . Our People Fished away, ducking and diving and all moves possible to continue their way of life . In year 1962 and also year 1964 Two Courts of the Queens Justices [ I am Being Sarcastic Here ] spewed the usual Drivel and do you know what ?? that not Twenty Years after the Universal Declaration of Human Rights of year 1948 [ not even Mentioned ] the Usual Drivel was being Spewed out again TWICE . I was there . The Fishermen Decided Not to Waste their Time at The House Of LORDs in the Cold Cold Winter of 1964/65 . Mind you that was near 1968 when we were Forgotten till Date . Visualise if you will their state of Mind . They had No Irish Rights and the only Rights were held by Five Jewish London Fish Merchants , the 1905 Lease of 5,000 years based on the 1661 Royal Charter . These Five owned the Tenancy and the paying of THE RENT of The Toome EEL Fishery which had just Lawfully beaten the crap out of them in the Courts of the Queen whose predecessor had issued The Royal War Prize Charter in The First Place . At this time one could smell in the Political Air a change of Events but this miasma of CIVIL RIGHTS InCOMING did not affect the Dickensian Courts of British Justice. Enter upon the Scene , the Belfast priest ,now of Toome who had been aware of the Court Case by talking to Fishermen NEAR TOOME . He must have at some stage told them to stop Kerning , Rymming ,Whinging and Crabbing and Girning ,moaning and groaning about their Long Lost IRISH RIGHTS and to be Practical and accept the UNACCEPTABLE . He urged them to gather their two or three hundreds of pounds apiece ,which they did along with about 600 other people ,their friends of the Lough Shore Communities and so bought out The Five [who it may be surmised also smelt the wind and took off ]and so They stepped back to Serfdom in under The Absentee English Landlord System of Tenure for the First Time and have been paying the RENT Since . All Well Homogenised by modern English Business Procedures so making the Reward for the Military SERVICES of a WarLORD palitable to their simple minds being Blessed by The Presence of A Priest ,an ancient Irish Requirement in any Project . You Know . They knowed it was wrong as they must have believed that "there was nothing else FOR It ". Even Today They Do Not Know who owns THEIR Co-Operative Shares but would like to, but he is not letting them know.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 10:10 AM

New song on the way! I was going to run it past Brian... but I have to run off to work, and I may not be able to get back to this tread until Sunday... so, look for it on the new song post... Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Wolfgang
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 11:37 AM

I have that song in a German songbook from 1975 and the notes to the song are interesting for they provide a quite different angle (if you read the before last verse, you'll see what the note means):

The song has originated from the conflict of the fishers of Lough Neagh with the state-owned Toome Eel Fishery. They defend their traditional way of living against the EEC (now: EC) and monopol interests with their price and market controls (my translation)

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 11:43 AM

Here is Larry's new song, Lough Neagh -- Agus a Lór, may I please add it to Mudcat Songbook?

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 12:00 PM

Please do! Cheers Lor


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 06:48 PM

Please All, I am a bit Overwhelmed with all this and I most likely owe several of you answers . As I am 65 years old I am not great at this machine as some of you may suppose but I am good at the Emails in and out and looking up stuff but all these other things are not at me Hands as yet . O,cuinn will be down soon [ Some of these days ] and we shall send Larry some stuff as he has Requested . Mean time I am steadily printing out all Emails to search for the People I owe Answers to . I very pleased with Larry's Song . I believe he is away for the weekend making moves on our Behalf , A Great FRIEND of those in Great Hunger for Freedom . Best to All .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 07:19 PM

Brian... many thanks for the compliments. I am off to Chicago tommorow, thought I was going to spend the day in court today, but spent most of the day running around. I may be able to drop into mudcact in the morning, then I will e-speak with you all on Sunday. Cheers Larry


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 24 Oct 02 - 04:23 PM

What a memory I Have , the URL thingy for our Humble Website is as follows Http://loughneagh.pro.ie . If there is any of you who reads Books nowadays I can mention Two Books for the very Serious Student of Irish History with the Lough Neagh [ reputed to be for many instances The Great Famine Stopper ] as central feature . The First Book was Writen by our Grandfathers' Law Speaker The Great T. M. Healy Q.C. . It was him who fought our claim to Irish Public Right on Lough Neagh to The House of Lords in Year 1910 . The name that is upon this 485 Pages Book is " STOLEN WATERS " . A few Years Later he wrote a Precis [ 192 pages ] of it for us simple minded People .[ Perhaps I should say Ordinary , Uneducated People our Elders of then till read ] The second Book called " THE GREAT FRAUD OF ULSTER " in year 1917. I also recommend a Book by the Name of "The Land War of Year 1770 " when one of the Chichesters [ Third Lord Donegall abouts ] by RACK RENTING directly caused 400,000 Presbyterians { Mostly] when the 99 years [ three lives Leases ] all fell due ,to flee to America . StoneWall Jacksons People were tenants of that Chichester , and at the start of the War for American Independance , Did he not Aclaim ," By The Eternal , THey shall NOT Rest on our Land " and made sure they did not .Harrumpt. I believe he also stated that, after the War Was Won, that they were The Most Resolute Faction forneinst the British Crown . These People came from Scotland wie high hopes but were skint alive , as much as the displaced natives who were scarcely tolerated to exist in the badlands , by the alleged Landlords AKA Promise Breaking Undertakers , Established Church and RENT and CESS Extracters/ Enforcers . Good Luck in Finding any of These Books .


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Subject: Lyr Add: ALBERT'S FAREWELL TO THE LOUGH
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 24 Oct 02 - 04:54 PM

I've been lying low as regards the Mudcat for a wee while, but I'm delighted to see this thread and Larry's follow-up getting so much action!

I don't want any of the following to be construed as a puff-piece, however I'd just like to add a few bits and pieces. Some of you may know that I edit the website "Pay The Reckoning" http://www.paythereckoning.com

where I've taken the opportunity to load up a lot of my original tunes and writings, as well as some stuff I've collected over the years.

I was born in Derrymacash, on the southern shores of Lough Neagh in an area known as "The Montiaghs" (after Mona Tí - land of the turf); my granda had been an eel-man in his early days and many of his "butties" - men like Albert Parkes, Jem McAlinden, Andy Hogan - were fishermen for eels in season and pollans in their season.

Many of my tunes are inspired by the experience of growing up in this area. I was surprised, looking back, just how many tunes I've written with the Lough, its wildlife and its lore as inspiration:

The Wee Lough (a reference to Lough Gullion, a small lake where some Lough Neagh eel fishermen from the Montiaghs also had a base)
Raughlan
Derryadd Bay
The Dabchick
The Dollaghan (a species of trout only found in Lough Neagh)
McGurran's Shore
Albert's Orange Eel
The Hairy Eel
Mick Doran's (Mick was a fisherman of my da's generation who was tragically drowned along with my cousin Seamus Crossey - there won't be their likes again!)
The Sconce

Also some of the stuff I've written or collected in the "Rants and Raves" section of Pay The Reckoning is directly connected with the Lough, or has the Lough as its backdrop - e.g. James Haughian's "Bonny Green Tie" and my own "The Ballad Of Joe Donnelly" and "Liverpool, Be Damned".

Anyway, thanks to Larry for his song. I learned recently that Albert Parkes, one of the oul stagers, a decent man and a great one for the crack, had passed on. I have a tape recording (courtesy of the mudcat's ard mhacha) of him and Jem McAlinden in conversation on a Northern Ireland radio show. It forms the basis for the following which goes to the tune of "The Croppy Boy".

The reference to the tra-doo comes via a mate of mine, Sid Blaney, who wrote a cracking short story some years back set in and around the Lough, called An Trá Dubh (The Dark Shore).

ALBERT'S FAREWELL TO THE LOUGH

The name is Parkes, from the bleak Bay Shore
I've fished the Lough for sixty years or more
I've baited hooks and I've run the lines
And I've lived through bitter and cruel times

I never larned for to write nor read
For books or larning I had no need
I need no map, no plan nor chart
For the coul' Lough water I know by heart

I spent my youth on a bed of straw
Where the flays did nibble and the varmins gnaw
And damn the feeding to grace my plate
There was only purters in the house to ate

And any money I ever gained
Was spent on porter and rum in Kane's
If I had money then I'd spend it free
And all were welcome for to drink with me

Money made, aye and money spent
And body broken, aye and body bent
But boys the crack when we made a haul
Down in McCorry's or the oul' Bay Hall

And orange eels, aye and hairy too
And eels that grunted, boys and eels that crew
And fairy weemen who were heard to cry
That wee Lough Gullion would not run dry

But now there's eels that we cannot sell
The oul' eel-fishing, boys, is gone to hell
You'd make more money signing on the broo
Than you'd ever make from the oul' tra-doo

My name is Parkes from the bleak Bay Shore
I've fished the Lough for sixty years or more
And done no harm, aye and caused no grief
And spurned no man cos of his beliefs

But now my time it is at an end
I'll never venture on the Lough again
I'm setting out for a distant shore
And I'll put my boat out on the Lough no more

Come all you boys from the Bay to Crow
From Derryadd and round to Kinnego
When you are out on the tear in town
Drink a health to Parkes who's buried in the ground


I think a CD of songs and tunes about the Lough would be great idea. There's been a few albums lately which are very local in nature - Gerry Lavery's "A Walk Through O'Hanlon Country" (songs from mid-Armagh) and Padraigin NiUallachain's An Dealg Oir (songs from South-East Ulster) to name but two. It's about time the Lough had its own collection. I'd be more than happy to play a part in such a project, in any small way.

Finally, if there's any way in which I can use Pay The Reckoning to "further the cause" perhaps the agitators could get in touch ... I could, for example, put up a separate page! PM me here or e-mail me at aidan@paythereckoning.com

.

All the best!


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 24 Oct 02 - 05:11 PM

Bhuel, a Aidan a stór -- Larry's out of town for a few days, so I'll be his 'front man' so to speak, and thank you for him . . .

I was hoping that you would see this thread, knowing where you come from, and I was also hoping that you would be willing to help with a song or two(?) for the CD. With a talent like your own to spread the word for Brian and the fishermen, we'll be doing all right!

Slán go fóill, Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Ard Mhacha.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:42 AM

And once again fair play to you Derrymacash, a great tribute to oul Albert.
And I will really get your dander up by saying,
dont forget Thomas Moore`s "Let Erin Remember",
"On Lough Neaghs banks were the fisherman strays,in the clear cool eve declining,
He sees the Round Towers of other days in the waves beneath them shining". Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: Lyr Add: LET ERIN REMEMBER THE DAYS OF OLD
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:30 AM

Sure why not have all of the song? It's hardly out of place on this thread, and good luck to all of the fishermen on Lough Neagh which is at this moment being blasted by a fierce gale.

LET ERIN REMEMBER THE DAYS OF OLD.
Thomas Moore

1.
Let Erin remember the days of old,
Ere her faithless sons betrayed her,
When Malachy wore the collar of gold
Which he won from her proud invader,
When her kings with standards of green unfurled,
Led the Red Branch Knights to danger,
Ere the emerald gem of the western world
Was set in the crown of a stranger.

2.
On Lough Neagh's banks, as the fisherman strays,
When the clear cold eve's declining,
He sees the Round Towers of other days,
In the waves beneath them shining.
Thus shall memory often, in dreams sublime,
Catch a glimpse of the days that are over;
Thus, sighing, look through the waves of time,
For the long faded glories they cover.

Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:01 PM

Good man, ard mhacha! There's edjimication behind St Peter's right enough!


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 26 Oct 02 - 09:25 AM

On thinking upon it the Act by our Absentee English Landlord,s Grandfather in signing the 1905 deed-in -tail upon which the Franchise of the Eels on which was the base of the operating rights of THE TOOME EEL FISHERY was a real slippery act . SOMEONE in the Group who applied for this ascendency Rights must have percieved the WEAKNESS of the Operating Brief of the Irish "LAND" Commission . This Body of Civil Servants and others who should have know that Irish Territory ,The Loughs , Lochs, rivers etc etc WERE Missed in the Irish Land Acts and not on the agenda for repatriation to the Local Fish Harvesters [ As food ] . Lough Neagh the 150 square miles being the largest Lake so missed . To do such an act as a Last Gasp of Absentee Landlordism when the greater portion of Ireland was returned to the Origional Owners I declared Outrageous . As well as the steadfast ignoring by the North and South Governments to date should be noted . Their inaction , therefore the maintainence of FEUDAL RIGHTS of An Absentee English LORD should be noted by the Electorate .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 26 Oct 02 - 10:07 PM

Hello folks, fishers and folkies... just back and need sleep, great to see the new post Derrymacash - after a few snores, after meeting, we will keep planing step one, end to rents, step two, reparations! Cheers Larry
PS Joel Landy wants me to do the new song on his TV show... we can use JPGs of the lough and fishing to project behind the song... night all...


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 27 Oct 02 - 01:44 PM

REPARATIONS ?? Vroom ,Oh , Ah ,EE Ohh Ohh Did Anyone See that Bus ?Now that is an Origional Idea WHAT I Welcome . Let me See 400 Years x 60 days [ Spawning Season ] x 3,000 Salmon [ 1,000 per each weir ] at £ 10 per Salmon equals a quer pile of Money . Would Do Nicely .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Áine
Date: 28 Oct 02 - 07:44 PM

Just refreshing this thread so Brian can find it. ;-)

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 29 Oct 02 - 07:15 PM

Right Folks , I dont want to be a sore head BUT have any of you got our Saga in any Press in America , local papers , Irish Society News letters or any thing , your websites or message boards . I do know that a few of the Best are making Moves on the other media . This Item is not a critism of them .Best to All .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: InOBU
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 07:32 AM

Hi Brian: When we get you on Sandy's radio show, and on Joel Landy's show, that may be enough to get our friend Georgina to cover the issue, then we can build from there... the other wee idea may make a little news as well, nudge nudge, hint hint, say no more, say no more! (I am makeing a few calls still...)
Cheers Larry
PS did you and Sandy email each other yet? Do, his show has a bunch of folks who listen, then we also can get you on WBAI soon, which may be a step towards WNYC, the Public Radio station, build one step at a time...


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 10:31 AM

You might be interested in hearing a wee sound snippet. It's of two eel fishermen of my granda's generation - Albert Parkes and Jem McAlinden - in conversation with Bobby Hanvey of Northern Ireland's Downtown Radio. I've spliced my jig "Arthur John Donnelly" to the end of the sample. Arthur John Donnelly was my granda on my ma's side and a good friend of Albert.

It's a biggish file (3.5Mb) and takes a while to download if you're using a modem!

Scroll down the page and stop at the first stop press!

Pay The Reckoning


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Ard Mhacha
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 03:43 PM

And would anyone unfamiliar with this accent, please tell me what Albert was talking about.
I would be very interested to know if you had much difficulty understanding. Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 01:16 AM

Ard Mhacha ...

If I had time I'd transcribe it for the benefit of them that spakes a language other than Montiagh!

Having said that I played the original tape to a mate of mine - a playwright that lives in London, but originally from Derryadd - and he couldn't make head nor tail out of it. I ended up translating!

Sometimes, though, the words aren't important. There are a rhythms and cadences in Albert's speaking which are starting to die out as the Lough shores become gentrified ...

Slán, a chara.

Aidan


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: belfast
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 09:14 AM

Just been listening to Albert et al. Great stuff (even if it did take about half an hour to download)and a fine wee tune at the end of it. And although I'm Belfast born and bred I didn't have too much difficulty understanding the chat.

As a matter of small interest, I had a drink recently with the fella who wrote the song that started this thread. Mind you, the only fishing he's ever done was on the Moy river when the bailiffs weren't about.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon of ARDBOE
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 10:02 AM

Yesterday an Item about a " Charitable " Organisation came to my Attention while surfing the NET. The Name that is upon this "Whatever" is THE HONOURABLE THE IRISH SOCIETY . It appears that this group had a Salmon Trap in Duggans Bays out at sea where the Salmon Came up round the corner from the Atlantic Ocean till get up the Bann . They also had two of the three Traps at The Cutts of Coleraine . The Combination of this Group and the Lords Donegalls and later their Inlaws The Earls Shaftesbury certainly made sure that the LEAST Portion of the SALMON got south of Toome Bridge and LOUGH NEAGH and the Ten Rivers Inflowing for the Indigenous natives . As far as I can figure The Lords Donegall / Shaftesbury had one trap at Coleraine , Portna and Toome where there is a Bridge. The Honourable The Irish Society having reduced The Vast Shoals to Remnant Shoals have ceased Commercial Catching of THE SALMON in around year 1985 and Formed The Bann System Ltd to francise out Angling Permissions .READ ALL ABOUT IT on Google after rapping in THE HONOURABLE THE IRISH SOCIETY . I would like to see some Comments here about these Wholesale Exporters of IRISH SALMON .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Ard Mhacha
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 01:56 PM

Derrymacash, Someone from Derryadd couldn`t understand oul Albert, bloody amazing, it wasn`t one of the FFordes, I say old boy. Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 03 Nov 02 - 11:25 AM

TO WOLFGANG , Presuming that you by now may have read some of my Writings on Lough Neagh . You will see that The Lough is not a State Owned Fishery but was the War Prize of The Main Political Family of Northern Ireland The Chichesters , The LORD Donegalls [ The New English Type ] not the Olde Irish Family of Tyrconnell as under The Brehon Code . The Pro British Faction of the North and their Judacy resolutely maintained The Ascendency by their 1910 and 1964 re cementing of their Feudal Privileges in the Courts of The Queens Justices and at the same time reassured The Dispossession the Descendants of the Native Irish . Bedammed was The 1948 Declaration of Human Rights . Read if you will THe Honourable THE IRISH Society on Google . This Group and The Lords Donegalls harvested 95% of the Salmon of Foyle and Bann exporting ALL to Feed English Bellies in ENGLAND.Your comments wiil be appreciated .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Wolfgang
Date: 04 Nov 02 - 11:14 AM

Brian, I'm still reading this thread with a lot of interest.

I've no own experience about that conflict whatsoever. I was only citing a note from a songbook and that's all I knew about the song before reading here.

I still find it fascinating that the same song can be seen in such a different light. Though that note maybe tells more about the Germany of the seventies and especially about the political opinions among the extreme left in Germany in that time (that's where the songbook comes from). They looked at all conflicts from one particular angle even if that meant a bit of twisting.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 04 Nov 02 - 07:31 PM

To Fibula and her English Friends , the reduction of the Native Irish to as near Slavery as was being under The Big Bad Absentee English Landlord System of Feudal Tenure was bad enough but was Mostly Ended when the Farming Peasants WERE ALLOWED to buy back their Family Land Holdings around year 1910 .THEIR Servitude being Over . Please Remember that this took up to the 1950's for them to clear and even some to the 1960's . The Leading back to this Feudal System by the Priest of these poor Landless Indigenous Fisher People is totally questionable in Principle regardless of the delusion of an Alleged Co-operative patriarchially governed by himself from one year after the Queens Justices done THE USUAL in year 1964 till date . Try to think of what you are trying to accept as o.k. The 1661 Royal WAR PRIZE Charter , The 1905 Deed -in-Tail writen at such a time of emancipation of most of the Irish People , and the 1965 Giant Step Backwards to RENT Paying straight till today . Right down the Feudal Chain of Power . The Shamanistic saying of The Holy Mass at the Start of the Fishing Season and this priest Blessing over his loyal faction of cohorts in a Fish Shed in that Village Called TOOME just does not cut it. We shall have our Ancestoral Collective INDIGENOUS FISHING RIGHTS returned to us . Strasbourg Here We Come .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 05 Nov 02 - 03:56 AM

eh? I'm not English, Brian. As I said, good luck to you, but settle down a bit. This is your cause, and I've only heard your side of it, which is why I have no wish to become embroiled in it.I do, however, hope you reach a peaceful, fair solution.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 05 Nov 02 - 04:02 AM

To be fair to my mate, the bits of the tape he had difficulty with were a bit more garbled than the portion I posted to Pay The Reckoning.

And no, he wasn't a fforde ... but a bit more gentrified than the gather-ups from Wolfs Island, I'd say!

Slán!


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 06 Nov 02 - 04:02 AM

So: no local word for "eel-stew"?

Regards


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 06 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM

Sorry Martin for the Delay in Getting back to you . I have never heard of any Eel Song and never even heard of EEl Stew ,our people cooked them basicily by ,skinning them , which takes a certain tecknique gutting and cleaning them out and chopping them into two inch sections and fried them on the EEL Pan , we had two pans ,one for meat and one for fish as people dont like meat being tainted with fish flavours not that we ate much meat most just bacon . Some of the elders used to frighten very young childer by showing them the EELs still twitching on the Pan as though they were alive but it was just nerves .We did not like it as we thought that the eels were in agony while being fried on the pan .BWT Are you sure your people are not from Ardboe .???.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 06 Nov 02 - 07:56 AM

Thanks, Brian - especially for the recipe!

I live near Lough Ree, which is also an eel fishery. Basically, the rights now belong to the electricity company (another long story) but some eels do make themselves available locally! here, an eel stew is called "growl-ya" - which I think I traced back to an Irish word. I was just curious...

Regards


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 05:49 PM

For You All Read all   www.irishsociety.infm.ulst.ac.uk/ This older Body also had three Salmon weirs across the Bann which being the First three weirs for to catch the Salmon and our Absentee Landlord's Family having the fourth , the fifth at Kilrea , and the Sixth Weir at TOOME should make it clear to the Cynics here that this was a great Salmon Diversion from Irish Stomachs to Fill English Stomachs over these last 400 years . Read all about where they have 250 miles of Fishing Rights leased out to about 15 angling clubs now that they have reduced the Vast Shoals to just enough Remnant numbers to bait Tourists and Anglers . Our Absentee stopped commercial Netting around the 1950's so few got to his nets but the sea ward group only ceased commercial catching in around year 1985 . Thank God for our Totem Fish THE DOLLAGHAN , The Pollan , Bream , Perch, Pike , EEL , etc ,etc .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Tenches and Brimes
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 08:17 AM

It was four and twenty years ago in search of fickle fame
I hit the road for faraway to make myself a name
I left behind my hooks and line, no more I'll run them down
And I said good-day to grey Lough Neagh where the dollaghan is found

The waves upon the ocean struck fear into my heart
I thought them retribution for my treachery to part
From hearth and home and family who grieved at my farewell
On that cruel day to grey Lough Neagh where the dollaghan does dwell

It's often at the peep of day I'd wake and make to rise
Before the sun in splendour was risen in the skies
For fishermen are up and out when all are fast asleep
To make their way across Lough Neagh to fish its waters deep

I've tunnelled and I've scaffolded and humped and hodded too
Of mud and blood and gutters, I could tell some tales to you
But damn thon oul' Dame Fortune, for she never took me in
And I cursed the day I left Lough Neagh where the dollaghan still swims

There's some who dream of silver and others dream of gold
And others dream of coortship, at least that's what I'm told
But often in the dead of night I dream I'm fishing yet
A fine Spring day on grey Lough Neagh hauling in a burstin' net

Oh God be good to fishermen and the Devil let them be
And don't let any fisherman come follow after me
For I've known heavy labour, aye and heavy misery
And times I pray for grey Lough Neagh where the dollaghan swims free

So fare thee well to Holloway, where I've squandered all my pay
I'm coming home to end my days beside the grey Lough Neagh
For I'll find no ease, no rest nor peace in all of London Town
There's sweet relief from pain and grief where the dollaghan is found


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 04:11 PM

Good on you T&B,Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Fleadhman
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 04:31 PM

I have just come back from the Geordie Hanna traditional singing weekend in Derrytresk Co. Tyrone on the shores of Lough Neagh. There was a new CD released of the late Geordie Hanna called The Fisher's Cot.This CD has some fine songs of Lough Neagh and the areas around it. I was given a tour of the area by John Hanna (Geordies son) including Brockagh, Arboe and Maghery from where Geordie used to take his boat out on the lough. If any of you get a chance you should visit this beautiful area and if you are fortunate enough to know someone like John with his knowledge of the area and its history you will be in for a treat. We were treated to a 3 hour session of Lough Shore songs and stories by local singers and story tellers.It was a fabulous weekend of history and ballad singing. I'm looking forward to next year already.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 16 Nov 02 - 12:15 PM

To Anybody   . Have any of you Read The Honourable The Irish Society Item . Anyone manage to get our Saga into any Press.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 17 Nov 02 - 09:08 AM

Have you tried the talkback web site?


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 17 Nov 02 - 03:23 PM

No, I have Not as I Do Not Know How to or Where to find it . I thought all Talk about Lough Neagh and The Bann River was being done here . Thank You for Input . But Just Instruct me as Requested .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 17 Nov 02 - 05:46 PM

Arggh I was going to mention it too but was worried I qould be stepping on your toes Brian, go to Talkback

I'm trying out the blue clicky thing so if i mess it up bear with me.

I think you would have to log on to start new topics,some time they pick up items for mentioning on the talkback radio show.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 17 Nov 02 - 05:47 PM

Yehaw the link works, goodluck with it.


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Subject: RE: Toome
From: GUEST,0123456
Date: 18 Nov 02 - 02:32 PM

IJPoKrTJj
A JrjqJ jJu ACKjnJKxtKa (mJÄuJPh ) - pJ xÄPãPk FIJAACKm (AIUB)


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 01:38 PM

So Sorry Guest 0123456 , I do not speak or write Outer Bogslobian .So whats you point in simple English Please .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 03:20 PM

For Dermod and Fibula and All . In The Newspaper " THE IRISH NEWS " on Monday 25 Nov 2002 , on Page 44 Left side Column there is a NOTICE about THE ALLEGED CO-OP who apparently have not held an A G M in either 2000, 2001 nor 2002 and no Dividends issued to Sharsholders either . Now what is your comments on this latest news .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: dermod in salisbury
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 06:20 PM

Hello Mr Hanlon
As always, I read your posts on this subject with interest in respect. Not least because I could see you know how to skin and cook an eel. My grand uncle on the Antrim shore was similarly adept and felt strongly against the licensing system. Unfortunately, the Irish News website doesn't hold the new item you mention, and requires an expensive subscription to search its archive.

I have looked elsewhere and see that the issues facing Lough Neagh fishing have been the subject of an Inquiry by the Northern Irish Assembly (in which all shades of politics participate when the Assembly is not in suspenstion!) It would seem from its report that natural eel stocks in the lough are at present in serious decline due partly to eel disease infestions spreading in Europe generally which is affecting both markets, stocks, and limits and catches. If true, this would possibly account for lack of current profitability and share dividend.

Once again, I must say that I personally have no knowledge of the present situation. But I suspect the issues have moved from absentee landlordism, even though these may, as you say, persist. I attach a link to the detailed NI Assembly Inquiry evidence summary. http://www.ni-assembly.gov.uk/culture/reports/report2-00r5.htm

Best wishes.

Dermod


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 03:36 PM

The Item was a NOTICE costing £300 for space as that Paper is a bit nervious of Legal Possibilities . After all The Courts of the Queeens Justices have twice in the last Century 1910 and 1964 declared for The Feudal Rights of The Absentee Earls and so the continual LEGAL SERVITUDE of THE NATIVE IRISH RENT PAYERS to this year 2002 . The Absentee English Earl being Recognised as THE OWNER and all Irish being THE TENANTS , the Fishermen from year 1965 only holding shares in a Company whose main PROPERTY is THE REST of the 5,000 year LEASE which has only 4,903 years to go along with two weirs and a couple of acres of Land and Sheds for fish Processing at each . The Grandfather of our Present Absentee ENGLISH EARl signed this Lease on the 18th of July in year 1905 based on the 1661 year Royal WAR REWARD Charter issued for the Military Services of Sir Arthur Chichester in the Nine Years WAR. Thank You Very Much . This Sneeky Deed was Done in the Same Time Period as Several Thousand Absentee English Landlords were signing bills of sale in the selling of Tens of Thousands of Family LAND Holdings BACK to the Irish Tenant Farmers who had held fast to their Holdings from they were Forfeited after the Nine Years WAR when they were reduced to Tenants in the First Place . But The Irish LAND Commission MISSED The WATERs of IRELAND leaving us the Indigenous Native Irish Fisher People of Lough Neagh under the powers of the 1905 DEED . FROM then we payed NO RENT till we were manervoued there by the Priest of Toome in year 1965 . I have Read those Reports , Have You . First His Written Submission and then his Interview with his two Cohorts of whom there is not one word of either speaking in two separate volumes . Also for your Education The Bann System Limited Written Submission and Interview . You should read Them as Well .They had 3 weirs and so had the Earls 3 weirs . That makes SIX SALMON WEIRS in all across THE BANN . YOU may just imagine just how many SALMON managed to slip past these Six Weirs for food for our People , fortunate the GOOD GOD had made Resident , Many Coarse Fish and the Good Fish The Pollan and our TOTEM FISH THE DOLLAGHAN . We dont mind paying GOVERNMENT LICENCES but paying An Absentee English LANDLORD in this day and age Rankles . Especially with all this talk of Human Rights And INDIGENOUS RIGHTs all over the world . Yanimami, Maoiri , Native Americans , the Aboriginals and many other making successful claims . we should be recognised as INDIGENOUS PEOPLE . I could go on you know ........


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 04:46 PM

Harking back to Fleadhman's comments on the Derrytresk weekend:I got a copy of the Geordie Hanna CD recently - and it's great!

Regards


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 05:24 PM

Brian have you tried the Talkback forum yet?


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 08:14 PM

No . Because I Do NOT Know how to Do So . Please Advise in all simple Steps . Thank You .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 06:49 AM

Hit the Talkback link I posted above, there is a simple registration process,enter your email address and pick a name.

I think a lot of people would be interested in what happens to the salmon etc. Sorry I'm not knowledgeable enough to start the topic, don't know what I would be on about.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 03 Dec 02 - 08:51 AM

Are you asking What happened the Salmon in the Past OR NOW ??? What point do you wish me to clarify ?


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: Ireland
Date: 03 Dec 02 - 09:43 AM

Brian would you agree that there is a lot of people here (N.Ireland/Ireland) who would want to know about your plight?

I cannot remember the name of the programme (Spotlight or lesser spotted Ulster ) about eel fishing/farming on the lough. I think if you were to put what you said on Talkback and ask to talk with the radio presenter David Dunseth(sp?) you may get more exposure. Phone Radio Ulster ask to speak to one of the researchers they may agree to give you some airtime.

BTW there was no mention of the fees etc. you mention so you could use that to raise interest in your plight.


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 10 Dec 02 - 02:24 PM

The Following NOTICE was in THE "IRISH NEWS" PAPER on MONDAY 25/11/2002 Page 44 left hand side. The "Irish News" is held to be The Main Nationalist Paper in Ireland .
                                     Would All Shareholders in the
    LOUGH NEAGH FISHERMENS CO-OPERATIVE SOCIETY LIMITED
not actually fishing on Lough Neagh for eels and who feel that due to the Lapses in Democratic Process the FAILURE to hold the 2000 and 2001 Annual General Meetigs and now the THIRD YEAR 2002 Annual General Meeting unheld so far as we have been told and who have NOT recieved their expected Annual Dividend in any of these three years . This Year So Far . The dividends usually paid around the month of May .Nor any Offered Explanation of why they were NOT held either along with the unpaid Dividends please telephone the following Number 07810 173397 and on it you will have the Facility to voice your concerns and fears on any aspect pertaining to the running of this Co-op that you feel obliged to point out .
   By doing this you are exercising YOUR DEMOCRATIC HUMAN RIGHTS as promulgated in the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights . You are FREE to Speak, Write, Organise in the Democratic Governances of the livelihood of your People . END of NOTICE .   
   Four Days Later on Thursday 28 November 2002 The Fisher Community were told that All Three Annual General Meetings will be Held in TOOME one after the other on the 16th of December 2002.Starting about 2 P.M. in the Co-op Offices . Need I Comment ??


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 24 Dec 02 - 10:34 AM

The Meeting was held . I will give a full report on it after Christmas . Meanwhile I wish you ALL The Best .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 02 Jan 03 - 08:16 PM

Hic ! Hic! Sorry Missed update about Meeting . Will Report SOON .


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Brian F. Hannon
Date: 17 Jan 03 - 08:39 PM

An Anecdotal Report of the 16th of December 2002 Meeting in TOOME . The Lament of a Lough Neagh Shareholding Fisherman .                Some Days ago I read in the Irish News 25/11/2002 a notice refering to The Lough Neagh Fishermens [ALLEGED]Co-Operative Society Limited about the fact that the Annual General Meetings for Years 2000,2001 and 2002 had NOT been held as Yet .Four days later on the 28/11/2002 I was Delighted to recieve by post a booklet from OUR Co-operative in the first pages on which was stated that these meetings were eventually going to be held on the 16/12/2002 one after the other in the afternoon in the Co-op Offices in TOOME . For year 2000 starting at 2:15 P.M. For year 2001 starting at 3:15 P.M. and for year 2002 at 4 P.M. I decided as a Shareholder to attend these Meetings and on approaching the door of the Room where the Meetings were going to be held I observed that it was being policed by two waterbaliffs of the Co-op. On arrival at this door I was stopped and checked out as a shareholder and was then permitted to enter . I sat myself down with the rest of the Faithful and waited till the Chairman Rev. Father Oliver P. Kennedy ,Accountant Mr. Malachy McGrady and two secretaries were seated . I never in my life was so disgusted as by the following three minutes of the proceedings . One Shareholder who had never been at a Annual General Meeting in his life before asked the Platform Party to Introduce themselves as a point of Courtesy to the Assembled Lough Neagh Fishermen and a few women and a couple of Children for the Benefit of those who did NOT know them by Sight The Chairman ignoring the request for this simple Courtesy answered him by Querying his Shareholding claiming that he had only a £50 Pound Share and was therefore NOT Entitled to SPEAK at this A.G.M. This Share holder assured him that he had a £100 Pound Share Holding . To this firm Statement spoken by the shareholder who was then crudely advised to SIT DOWN , SHUT UP or BE THROWN OUT of the meeting by Voices from The MOB behind him . This UNDEMOCRATIC Procedure NOT being Rebuked by The Chairman .The Shareholder obliged and sat down , this brave shareholder having been heckled during this Interplay by several other voices from the body of the other shareholders arranged all around the Party of Eight Men of a Lobby Group . Each of whom had been Close MARKED around by Eight of The Heavy MOB . Proceedings continued by Rev. Father Kennedy and Mr. McGRADY speaking and covering the three years one after the other in little over an Hour .The Meeting had started at 2:15 P.M. and was concluded by 15:30 P. M. in much less time as promised in the Booklet .As proceedings were winding down another shareholder stood up and asked if there were ANY QUESTIONS allowed from the floor about ANY OTHER BUSINESS . He was TOLD to SHUT UP by the Mob and the Meeting having IMMEDIATELY been Declared Concluded .The Group of Now Further Disgusted Shareholders rose to WALK OUT in Disgust . One of them Aclaiming that he would get answers from Press or a Lawyer somehow. In all my many years as a Lough Neagh Fisherman and a Shareholder from the Start I am now in Serious Doubt about this Long Leadship of our Co-Operative by this Priest who was Discretely Imposed upon us by The Church which remains Silent and Whose Bishops Speak no Words of TROCAIRE on the INDIGENOUS NATIVE IRISH FISHER PEOPLE of LOUGH NEAGH . Their FATE of being lead back in under The Absentee English Landlord System of TENURE after year 1964 by Usual Decision against THE NATIVE IRISH of The Courts of THE QUEENS JUSTICES and their subsequent Blessing of all his Hardline Patriarchial Repressions by Bishops Philbin and Cahal DALY is in question seeing as we are now ALLOWED till fish in Lough Neagh NOT BY ANY IRISH RIGHTS but by paying THE RENT by the Powers of a LANDLORDS LEASE made out in year 1905 based on a WARLORDS Royal WAR REWARD Charter of year 1661 .Ten Generations of LORDS to the Present ABSENTEE ENGLISH LORD who still recieves his Royalties to this year 2003. And now we are in the Term of a Third SILENT BISHOP . Just how far will The Bishops of Ireland go in Maintaining STATUS QUO of The Ascendency . ???


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,Richard Wallace of Chicago
Date: 30 Mar 06 - 01:46 PM

Can anyone tell me the whereabout of Brian Hannon?

Richard


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST
Date: 25 May 09 - 03:18 PM

Brian F. Hannon of Ardboe .LOUGH NEAGH , Northern Ireland ,

This Day 25th May Year 2009 .

I AM BACK .

Have ANY of You Any Knowledge of THE IRISH REPUBLICAN NEWS BULLETIN BOARD . Based In Galway City . In The Republic Of Ireland . A Board Given To Discussion of THE Political PROBLEMS Of THE People of IRISH And Irish American Citizenship .In These Present Years ,

    Are Any of You Still Members of It .I Have Been Striving To Join This Board For ABOUT Three Years Now .

       I Will Be Very Obliged To Any Kind Soul Who Will Email Me With His Telephone Numbers and His Address. or His OWN Email Number .

Please Email Me at brian.hannon@btinternet.com


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,paul mc gibbon
Date: 21 Dec 10 - 07:44 AM

come on boys and girls we need to get this up and running again


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Subject: RE: Toome Eel Fisheries - Free Lough Neagh!
From: GUEST,kath.w.
Date: 13 Jun 11 - 08:44 AM

where can I find the words and music to the song about "the lough neagh fishermen"I once had a copy of a book of makem and clancy songs and I think it was included in it. The first line or two went like this:
"I am a fisher, I follow the eel along the lough neagh shore........."


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